Government Operations Committee on Sept. 12th, 2024

[George Chahal, Liberal, Calgary Skyview, AB]

Thank you.

Mr. Clark, you mentioned that Governor Murphy was at one of the events you hosted. I recently noticed that Governor Murphy just signed, with the State of New Jersey and the Province of Ontario, a memorandum of understanding. I think Premier Ford, the Conservative premier of Ontario, talked about the importance of this relationship of creating economic collaboration and jobs. I believe it's close to $10 billion between New Jersey and Ontario.

Is some of your work to make sure that when we have strong trading between states and Canadian provinces, we create those linkages? Could you reflect a little bit more on that?

[Thomas Clark]

I think this is a good example.

I first met Governor Murphy within about a month of my arrival in my posting here. I went to New Jersey and had a conversation with him, and I started needling him at that point about why he hadn't done a trade and diplomatic mission to Canada. He had been to many other places.

He is a very worldly guy, very connected politically in the United States. I kept at him, and as our relationship grew and we saw more of each other, the outcome was, “All right, we're going to go to Canada, if just to get you off my back,” and that happened.

In the New Jersey delegation, there were a lot of academics. We were talking about ties between Canadian universities, Canadian centres of excellence and what was happening in New Jersey, as well as the film industry. As you know, trade these days is not our selling a box of what we make to them and their selling a box of what they make to us; trade is what we make together.

Going back to the integration of the economy, the New Jersey case is a perfect example of it. We have inputs that they need for New Jersey products, and vice versa. I was delighted when the governor told me that there were memoranda of understanding, not only in Ontario but also in Quebec, where they had some terrific meetings. We know, because we're doing a lot of follow-up on this, that there's a lot of follow-up coming out of that. That's a real benefit to Canada.

[George Chahal, Liberal, Calgary Skyview, AB]

As you stated, part of your role in hosting Governor Murphy and others is to help build connections for trade relations so that we can expand trade. I find it odd today that Conservative MPs are attacking your role as consul general in New York for the very good work that you and your team have done in advancing Canadian trade relationships and economic collaboration and jobs.

I saw Premier Ford stand up and say how great this partnership is going to be for Canada and for Ontario. I also saw Governor Murphy talk on BNN about the importance of Canada to the U.S.

I don't have a lot of time left, but is there anything you want to add regarding not just New Jersey and that specific relationship, but on some of the other states that have integral roles with our Canadian economy?

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

I'm sorry, Mr. Clark, I have to interrupt. We've gone about a minute past our time, but perhaps you can respond in the next intervention.

We are now going to Mrs. Vignola for two and a half minutes, please.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Clark, the Park Avenue residence is a co‑op, whereas the one on Billionaires' Row is a condo. From what the agents have told us, that is actually a marketing ploy. In both cases, there is a board of directors.

Does Canada or a member of your team sit on the board of directors of either the Park Avenue residence or the new one?

[Thomas Clark]

I have no idea, Mrs. Vignola. It's outside my purview.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you.

You still live in the co‑op on Park Avenue. When will you be moving to the new residence?

[Thomas Clark]

I will move when I am told it is time to do so.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Okay.

The receptions you host are still held at the residence located on Park Avenue. Is that correct?

[Thomas Clark]

That's right.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Did you or any member of your team receive any emails or messages from other members of the co‑op regarding the new restrictions on hosting receptions or the inconvenience it might cause the other members?

[Thomas Clark]

I've never received anything, but again, it's not my area of responsibility.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Okay.

Would it be possible for you to ask your team about this and send us the answer?

[Thomas Clark]

Yes, certainly.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Clark.

Have a great day.

I'll cede my time to someone else.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thank you, Mrs. Vignola.

Mr. Bachrach, go ahead, please.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Clark, if you'll humour me, I'd like to return to this question of the memo and your role or non-role in the process and parse some of the words in the original memo and the amended memo.

By my reading, there are three steps in this process. This is sort of a three-step ditty. You need to identify the need to find a new property, so there was the process of identifying the shortcomings with the existing property and the need to replace it. That was the first step.

The second step was to select a new property. That step included, as the committee has heard, looking at a number of different properties in the neighbourhood in New York. The third step was the approval of that selection and the decision to make the purchase.

Does that seem like a fair characterization of the overall process?

[Thomas Clark]

As I understand it, it does.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

To go back to the June 17 memo, the memo stated that “Both the mission, including the HOM (head of mission), and the property team in Ottawa, agreed on the need to identify a replacement property.”

To me, that reads like step number one. It's identifying a need at the very start of the process.

The amendment on July 25 stated that no heads of mission were part of the “selection or approval process for the overall process or the property purchase”.:

That strikes me as referring to steps two and three in that three-step process. I'm concerned that the amendments seem to be parsing these words and referring to different parts of the process to avoid mistruths. I'm not going to jump the shark, as my Conservative colleagues have, and accuse you of lying, but is it not true that this amended version on July 25 could in fact be true and that you could have also had a role in identifying the need for a new apartment?

[Thomas Clark]

Mr. Chair, that's a completely legitimate question, and perhaps I can clarify it.

I agree with you that there are three steps to this. The first step has to be the decision to move on, to sell the residence and to look for something else.

Let me make it abundantly clear. As I said in my opening statement, I had absolutely no role, no discussion, nothing to do with the decision to sell the old residence and move elsewhere. That takes care of step number one. I just wanted to give you that clarification.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Okay. I appreciate that. Thanks.

I'll hand it back to you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thanks, Mr. Bachrach.

Mr. Barrett, please go ahead.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Let's say a Canadian who didn't know Prime Minister Justin Trudeau went to buy a condo on their own and let's break down those numbers. Let's say they have a 20% down payment and they get a great mortgage rate, which is tough after nine years of Justin Trudeau and the economic vandalism that he's perpetrated on Canadians. That would work out to about $42,000 a month for your residence.

How much do you pay in rent each month for your official residence? Could you give us just the number, please?

[Thomas Clark]

It's $1,800.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

That's $1,800 on $42,000 a month, so it's fair to say you're getting a massive subsidy worth tens of thousands of dollars for your rent every single month. Is that correct?