Government Operations Committee on Nov. 19th, 2024

[Robin Dubeau]

I wouldn't be able to comment on this.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Of course. The bottom line is that he is the head of the mission. Someone five, six or 10 layers below him is not going to make a decision to GAC that says, in my view, this official residence is no longer suitable and we need an immediate replacement. That comes from the top, and it's filtered down. That was a direction made by Tom Clark.

He influenced GAC in making this decision. Isn't that correct? He was instrumental. He gave the green light. He has lied to this committee. Do you agree that he has lied to this committee?

[Robin Dubeau]

To my knowledge, he didn't lie to the committee. To my knowledge, I received a comment that had been referred from his staff to our project management team. It's been written in the document—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

You think the words, “we need an immediate replacement of this extravagant penthouse in New York City”, were just made as a comment in passing, like “how's the weather today” or “what are you doing for the weekend?” It's a direction. Do you believe that's a direction? It's an immediate replacement. I want a new residence. This old residence is not suitable for me. That's a direction. Do you agree?

[Robin Dubeau]

Mr. Clark didn't mention that to me.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Thank you.

I cede my time to Mrs. Kusie. Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

You have two and a half minutes.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you very much.

Are head of chancery and head of administration the same currently at CNGNY?

[Robin Dubeau]

Yes. The management consular officer is the head of administration. I mentioned head of administration for simplicity.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Perfect. Thank you so much.

Who were the heads of property under Mr. Bot and Mr. Veenstra, please?

[Robin Dubeau]

Who would report to them?

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

That's correct.

[Robin Dubeau]

I wouldn't know their names.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Okay. Could you please find out the information and get that to the committee, please?

[Robin Dubeau]

I can look it up, yes.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you.

Under the current platform structure, does WSHDC still have responsibility over CNGNY?

[Robin Dubeau]

Can you repeat the first acronym? I'm sorry.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

It's WSHDC. Does it still have responsibility in the platform over CNGNY?

[Robin Dubeau]

No.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Okay. That's interesting. That's changed.

When I left the platform, Washington still had responsibility over CNGNY. In your opinion, as an employee at a mission, would you do anything you possibly could to fulfill the request of the head of mission?

[Robin Dubeau]

If you're at the mission, you try to do what is best for the operations of the mission, which includes the head of mission being able to deliver what he needs to deliver.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Certainly.

Would you say that the head of mission has the final say in terms of decision-making regarding the mission?

[Robin Dubeau]

Regarding mission operations, the head of mission has the authority.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you for that.

Mr. Chair, I will say to Canadians who are watching that I was at Global Affairs Canada for close to a decade and a half. I served in missions abroad, and I can tell you that the head of mission has the final say on all the decisions.

You, as an employee in the mission, will do whatever you possibly can to fulfill the will of the head of mission. If the head of mission wants an event, you will do whatever you can to create that event for that head of mission. If the head of mission wants a relationship built, you will do whatever you can to create that relationship for the head of mission. If the head of mission, in this case, wants a new property, you will do whatever you can in an attempt to get that head of mission the new property.

You said yourself that the mission informed you. Unfortunately, it seems to be that you continue to run cover for Mr. Clark, so I will ask you one final time: Did Tom Clark lie to this committee?

[Robin Dubeau]

No, Tom Clark didn't lie to this committee.

This decision was made independently by headquarters, and he didn't have influence over it.