Government Operations Committee on May 3rd, 2022

[Joanne Thompson, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

Is that the partnership you referenced in your opening comments?

[Shaun Padulo]

I did not reference the Seaspan partnership.

[Joanne Thompson, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

No, you didn't. It was more general.

[Shaun Padulo]

Correct.

[Joanne Thompson, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

Thank you.

In December 2021, in the sessional paper, the Canadian Coast Guard lists commonalities between both polar vessels as a risk factor for this project. Are Heddle and Seaspan in discussion with Davie about the polar icebreaker design?

[Shaun Padulo]

Not that I know of. We're not in discussions with Davie, but I can't speak for Seaspan on that subject.

[Joanne Thompson, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

This might be difficult for you, but I'll ask anyway. How are the delays in the Davie negotiations with the federal government affecting the design process for Seaspan's polar icebreaker?

[Shaun Padulo]

Again, I don't want to speak on behalf of Seaspan. With two designs, there will be some complex logistical challenges that could be created, but I can't speak on behalf of Seaspan in terms of how it will impact their design.

[The Chair, Conservative, Robert Gordon Kitchen]

Thank you.

We'll now go to Ms. Vignola for six minutes.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I will address Mr. Fulfaro.

Mr. Fulfaro, in 2017, with the support of Naval Group, you submitted a proposal to the Government of Canada, which was rejected, as you said earlier.

Who contacted you to file this proposal? Did you initiate it or did someone contact you?

I'm just trying to understand.

[Achille Fulfaro]

It was our initiative. We were not contacted regarding this because we were confident at that time with a French partner on the value for proposal. We were confident on the price. We were confident on the quality. We were confident that our proposal, considering the discussion we had with a user up to that time, was the best solution.

Going out from the bidder, we decided to make an unsolicited proposal.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you.

In your proposal, you suggested that Irving Shipbuilding build the FREMMs. What was your rationale for choosing Irving Shipbuilding over all the other builders in Canada?

[Achille Fulfaro]

It's because Irving is capable. We know Irving. We know the skills and facilities. We feel that we could be the right partner. We could also be the right partner not only for the production, but for the complete management of the program.

I want to underline the fact that the key issue is not to produce the ship. The key issue is to manage the program, considering also the different phases of the program, including one of the most critical phases, the integration of the combat system, the combat system function and integration.

We were confident at the time that having a local shipyard, and also considering our experience with other local shipyards in the world, it was possible.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you.

Quebec has already done business with the Fincantieri shipyard for the F.-A.-Gauthier, a ferry between Matane and Baie-Comeau or between Matane and Godbout, Quebec.

After barely three weeks in service, the carpets in the lounges were frayed and the door handles were coming off. People on the North Shore and in the Lower St. Lawrence region of Quebec are amazed when the ship is on the water four weeks in a row.

Is it possible that the setbacks experienced in 2015 made the Government of Canada less interested in your proposal?

[Achille Fulfaro]

I'm sorry. Is that question to me?

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Is it possible that Quebec's setbacks with a ship purchased directly from Fincantieri influenced the Government of Canada's decision to set your proposal aside instead of giving you an opportunity to correct the situation?

[Achille Fulfaro]

Yes, I can reply in a general view regarding this. We are open, also, to consider the Quebec capabilities. It's not a problem.

I repeat again, the problem is not the local shipyard. The problem is not the local capabilities. The problem is how you manage the program, considering the investment you have to make, considering the local supply chain you have to create. Fincantieri is not having any problem also considering Quebec.

Also, we can have good experience in Canada, considering that we have Vard Canada, which has very important data for design, and also Vard Electro, for the system capabilities, and other important companies that can support us.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Fulfaro.

Nonetheless, the F.-A.-Gauthier is often in dry dock for repairs due to various problems with the engine, ventilation, etc.

I will continue with Mr. Padulo.

Mr. Padulo, in 2020, you partnered with Heddle Shipyards to build some modules for the polar icebreaker. At this stage, do you know which module it is?

[Shaun Padulo]

We have a general idea of what the components will be, but again, it's still too early in the design phase for us to have specific sections of the ship that have been dedicated or understood to be built at Heddle. Until the design is more mature, we won't have that understanding.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

If I understand correctly, since the design is not very advanced, there is no construction schedule yet, let alone a delivery schedule.

[Shaun Padulo]

I apologize. Can you repeat your question one more time?

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

If I understand correctly, since the design is not complete, the details are not yet set and there is no construction schedule or delivery schedule.

Is that right?

[Shaun Padulo]

From my understanding, there is a schedule in place to deliver the vessels before the 2030 imperative. However, based on the fact that design is still in a very immature phase, I don't have insight into when we'll start building modules, and also the overall schedule for the project.

Seaspan would be the prime on that project in B.C., and Davie would be the prime on the project, for example, in Quebec for the second polar icebreaker.

Unfortunately, I don't have the details on the overall schedule yet.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Robert Gordon Kitchen]

We will now go to Mr. Johns for six minutes.