Evidence of meeting #83 for Government Operations and Estimates in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was work.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Kristian Firth  Partner, GC Strategies
Clerk of the Committee  Ms. Aimée Belmore

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Kelly McCauley

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 83 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Government Operations and Estimates.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) and the motion adopted by the committee on Monday, October 17, 2022, the committee is resuming its the study of the ArriveCAN application.

I'll remind you not to have your earpieces near your microphone, as it causes feedback and potential injury. In accordance with our routine motion, I'm letting everyone in the committee know the witnesses appearing by video conference have completed the required connection test in advance of the meeting.

Mr. Firth, we will turn things over to you, for five minutes.

3:40 p.m.

Kristian Firth Partner, GC Strategies

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and good afternoon.

I am grateful to finally have the opportunity to correct the mistakes, omissions and falsehoods that have been voiced at and by this committee, and in the newspapers, over the past number of weeks.

The first one is with respect to my summons. I readily accepted the committee's invitation to appear, as I did last year, when I was the first to show up and testified for over two hours. I told the committee that because of parenting responsibilities this week, I could be available for one hour, but the committee preferred the two hours I'd be available the following week. I was portrayed as a reluctant witness who was playing hard to get. This is actually far from the truth.

Without this opportunity to appear here today, GC Strategies would continue to be bound to the confidentiality agreement with Botler that was conveniently presented to me for signature right before it started feeding the media with information. It wasn't out of choice that GC Strategies remained silent after learning of the numerous allegations made by Botler, especially being on the other side with contradicting information.

I welcome the opportunity to again explain my business and the contracting processes for government departments that have existed for several decades. The system has outsourced many contracting functions to the private sector. I was not around when this practice was established, but presumably the belief was that a competitive private sector could operate better than an increased bureaucracy.

The system provides that only qualified private sector vendors can bid on and receive government contracts. Becoming a qualified private sector vendor is not easy or quick. Many checks for security and reliability are required. GC Strategies has been a qualified vendor since 2015. There are between 600-700 such qualified vendors in Canada, competing on a daily basis to provide services to government departments and agencies.

These vendors range from very large companies that do work in-house to smaller vendors, such as ours, that put teams together on a case-by-case basis. This competitive system forces qualified vendors to continually deliver quality services at competitive rates, or they would simply not be able to secure work.

Because we rely on teams on a case-by-case basis, it is imperative that we cultivate relationships with service providers and advance their interests. However, we also need to maintain connections with departments to understand their needs and understand where the market is heading.

That is my business, and I'm proud of it, as I'm sure all other vendors in Canada are proud of theirs. You may not like the system that is in place. You might think the government can do the job better itself. You may not respect our work, and that is your right.

I, like all people running a business, make mistakes. We try to learn from our mistakes, but, in all honesty, we'll likely make more. GC Strategies made a mistake by sending the wrong version of the resumé, which ended up being submitted to the Government of Canada for the task authorization; however, this regrettable mistake was not intentional, and it in no way determined the awarding of the contract.

In short, the CBSA had pre-qualified the owners of Botler to do the work, as they were the only two resources with knowledge of their software. Botler was approved before any resumé was submitted or a task authorization created. This is all relevant to the specific events surrounding Botler.

Botler was a client I recruited because I thought it could fill an important need for the government's compliance with Bill C-65. I thought its specific product would be useful for many departments. I spent the better part of two years working with Botler and introducing it to various departments. The CBSA was one of them, but there were many more. I was even working with Botler to get it qualified as a vendor, so it could fulfill contracts directly, eliminating the need for vendors like GC Strategies.

The Botler pilot was delivery based, so Botler would get paid only when it delivered. It delivered the first two deliverables and was then paid everything it was owed. At no time did GC Strategies ever receive money for those deliverables that we did not immediately pass on to Botler.

Botler stopped delivering what was required of it, and the CBSA terminated the contract. I was asked to gather from Botler all new work that was done prior to termination and submit that to the CBSA for a review and payment. Nearly two months passed. At that point, Botler submitted the remaining four deliverables, along with an invoice. The deliverables were then submitted to the CBSA, and they were not approved. The documents were unreadable, and once a version came through that could be evaluated, the CBSA determined the work to be substandard, and it refused to pay.

That leads us here today.

Let me be clear. The Botler pilot project was in no way connected to ArriveCAN. GC Strategies made no money whatsoever after working with Botler for two years, including the pilot. GC Strategies, Dalian and Coradix each had their own individual contracts to complete work on ArriveCAN. At no point did GC Strategies work with or act as a subcontractor on Dalian or Coradix's contract for ArriveCAN. All work done for the ArriveCAN app by GC Strategies was done using our own contract.

Thank you.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Kelly McCauley

Thank you very much.

We'll start with six minutes for Mr. Brock.

Actually, it's Mr. Barrett.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

The name of your company is GC Strategies. Is that correct?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

Yes, it is.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

How many staff work at GC Strategies?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

We have two employees, but we outsource our finance and legal—

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

Do you do app programming or design?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

No, we do not.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

Your role in terms of IT contracts for the federal government is that you're the middleman between the government and the people who do the work. Is that correct?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

We are responsible for bringing in individuals and building teams that the federal government would not have access to, as it does not have them on staff. It also does not have recruitment capabilities.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

The recruitment capabilities of direct messaging people on LinkedIn.... I'm sure a value could be ascribed to that, and we're actually going to see what that value is. You worked on the $54-million ArriveCAN app. Is that correct?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

Yes, it is.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

The work on that app is now under RCMP investigation. Is that correct?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

Not that I'm aware of.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

You're not aware of the RCMP investigating any of the work related to GC Strategies or anyone that you were contracted by or subcontracted to?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

That's correct. My understanding from the testimony that I've heard—and it was clarified by some honourable members—is that right now the RCMP is investigating only the Botler accusations, not ArriveCAN.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

Did you work with Botler?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

I worked with Botler for two years as their representation. We were in partnership.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

How much money have you made so far from contracts with the Government of Canada?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

I'm sorry. I don't have those numbers in front of me. I wasn't prepared for that question. I apologize.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

You weren't prepared to tell the committee, when we're here to ask you about your contracts with the government, how much you've been paid by the government for your contracts.

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

This is the ArriveCAN application study. This isn't a “contracting with GC Strategies and the federal government” study.

I've already given up all the information that I have on the application, on ArriveCAN, which is the basis of the study. I've given two hours of testimony. I've given hundreds of pages of documentation, and we're awaiting the Auditor General's report.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Barrett Conservative Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON

You had to be summoned to appear here today, sir. You don't even have the basic details about the work you've done for the government.

How much money was GC Strategies paid to not do any programming or app design for the ArriveCAN app?

3:45 p.m.

Partner, GC Strategies

Kristian Firth

I think I clarified in my opening statement that the reason I was summoned was that one hour was not sufficient—