Government Operations Committee on Nov. 30th, 2023

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I join my colleagues in welcoming the minister and her staff to this meeting.

Minister, you reflected on your time as the Minister of Public Services and Procurement. Obviously, that was from 2019 to 2021. During that time, you oversaw Canada's procurement processes, during the COVID-19 pandemic. I would suggest that some processes were abandoned or replaced with measures that made it easy for the current Liberal government to actually exploit the pandemic and award contracts to Liberal insiders and their friends.

My first question for you, Minister, concerns the advent of ArriveCAN. Do you recall who made the decision to go with the ArriveCAN app?

[Anita Anand]

I thank the honourable member for the question. I would like to wish her a very happy birthday from afar.

I will clarify, in reference to your question, that none of the contracts relating to that app came through my office. The CBSA, I understand, is the business owner. PSPC was the contracting authority, but the contracts were executed at the ADM level or below. I didn't sign off on this matter.

I do take the point that we need to continue to improve our processes in this manner. I have asked my department—some of the officials are here—to ensure that we are reviewing supply arrangements and to make sure that we're working with PSPC so that they can examine the profit margin on these contracts. Then we can provide guidance to auditors in these matters, and we can work with PSPC to modernize training for procurement specialists. Again, I did issue the manager's guide relating to third party contracting very early in my tenure, recognizing that we can do more work in this area.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Thank you very much, Minister.

As I'm sure you are aware, earlier this fall, numerous contracting discrepancies were reported in The Globe and Mail, which have resulted in a criminal investigation. These discrepancies involve three companies and the CBSA. This has resulted in accusations that are very serious and that include identity theft, collusion, forged résumés and fraudulent contracting.

While I hear what you have said about the measures that you are undertaking to ensure proper training for individuals who are involved in the contracting process, my question to you would be whether or not the Treasury Board is conducting a review of what happened with the ArriveCAN contractors. Will your department follow the CBSA's example and ban the companies involved from government contracts for at least 180 days, due to the revelations uncovered at this committee?

[Anita Anand]

The role of the Treasury Board is very much forward-looking. It is to put in place directives and policies that will support good practices and good governance in the public service. That's why the manager's guide on procuring professional services is forward-looking. It is hopefully going to be very useful for our procurement specialists.

We are working with PSPC in matters relating to outsourcing—for example, reviewing the supply arrangement, looking at profit margins and making sure that it is able to modernize training for procurement specialists.

I will say that this matter has multiple reviews under way by the OAG and other bodies. We will be following the progress of the multiple reviews, but the actual matter of reviewing this particular contract is not under the Treasury Board.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Mr. Chair, how much time do I have, please?

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

You have 30 seconds.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Thank you.

I would just end by noting that the Treasury Board is also responsible for accountability and ethics. I would hope that is taken very seriously as these reviews are being conducted.

Thank you.

[Anita Anand]

Thank you. We do.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thank you, Mrs. Block, and happy birthday.

Mr. Kusmierczyk, you have five minutes, please.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you so much, Minister, for being here at the OGGO committee in your new position and role. Obviously, you're no stranger to this committee.

I have a question for you, Minister. The President of the Treasury Board is responsible for supporting both official languages. Today, we learned that a Conservative MP from Alberta, who is also the shadow minister for Canadian heritage, berated the francophone Minister of Canadian Heritage for answering a question in French.

Can you comment on—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

I have a point of order on relevance.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

It's not an appropriate point of order.

Go ahead, Mr. Kusmierczyk.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Minister, I want to ask you this: How important is bilingualism to your work at the Treasury Board and to the work of the Treasury Board?

[Anita Anand]

Thank you for the question.

It is fundamental that all federal civil servants are able to work in the official language of their choice.

As President of the Treasury Board, I am responsible for implementing Part VII of the Official Languages Act, which was amended by Bill C‑13 and applies to the federal government. I will continue to work with my colleagues here and with other public servants to ensure that this law is properly implemented. It’s also important that we tackle the issue of harassment, discrimination and violence in government. We need to do this. We can all work in either official language. Personally, I intend to speak in both official languages at every meeting and whenever I appear before a committee. I hope everyone will be able to do so too.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Thank you, Minister.

I have a follow-up question for Madame Marie-Chantal Girard. We had Mr. Tolga Yalkin from the Office of the Superintendent of Financial Institutions appear before the OGGO committee. This was back in 2021. Mr. Yalkin said, “We quickly recognized that in a virtual environment it's so important for norms to be established so that the way in which people are given opportunities to use the official language of their choice is supported.”

How important is it, Ms. Girard, to support and encourage staff, officials, to use the official language of their choice? How important is that here on Parliament Hill?

[Marie-Chantal Girard]

The minister will start.

[Anita Anand]

I’d just like to say one thing, to begin with. As an English-speaking minister, I believe that it’s crucial, in the current climate in our country, to make sure that everyone has the opportunity to learn and speak both official languages.

I’ll let Ms. Girard add something if she wishes.

[Marie-Chantal Girard]

Absolutely. Thank you, Madam President of the Treasury Board.

It is absolutely essential, and it is the law. It is an act.

To allow the transition to a virtual environment, we've put in place several measures for the majority of public servants to be able to function in both official languages. We've included closed captioning. Now when you use Teams, you can click on closed captioning and have a transcription in the language the person speaks, which will make it easier to capture all the nuances there.

We've provided some training, and we also made sure, in collaboration with the Public Service Commission, that we were able to continue to test and make sure that employees are meeting the language requirements of their positions and, if not, to make sure they would withhold their language profile during that period.

A lot was done, and I'm proud to be the Treasury Board Secretariat delegate for official languages.

Thank you for the question.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thanks, Mr. Kusmierczyk.

Next is Mrs. Vignola for two and a half minutes, please.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you very much, Chair.

When I read the Supplementary Estimates, one of the questions that most often comes to mind is: why weren’t these funds foreseeable? In other words, why weren’t they part of the Main Estimates?

Sometimes, too, I literally wonder what certain funds correspond to. For example, in the Supplementary Estimates, I see that some funds are for critical operating requirements. For the Canadian Transportation Accident Investigation and Safety Board, those funds amount to $3,748,724; for the Canadian Intergovernmental Conference Secretariat, they amount to $1,428,839; for the Treasury Board Secretariat, they amount to $11,873,293.

What are these critical operating requirements? Why weren’t they foreseen in the Main Estimates?

[Anita Anand]

That's actually a very good question, because we do try to put the bulk of the items in the main estimates, but there are items that occur during the course of the year that are unpredictable or unexpected. Those items do make their way into the supplementary estimates (A) or the supplementary estimates (B).

I will ask my esteemed colleague to respond as well.

[Annie Boudreau, Assistant Secretary, Expenditure Management Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat]

Thank you, Madam President of the Treasury Board.

As you know, since it is often discussed at this committee, the federal budget is tabled around March, then the annual Estimates…

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

We understand that quite well. I would like to know what the critical operating requirements are.

[Annie Boudreau]

Critical operating requirements are unexpected occurrences. For example, sometimes there are additional workloads that we didn’t anticipate and therefore were not part of the initial budget requests.