Government Operations Committee on Feb. 12th, 2026

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

That means that in the case of a nuclear reactor project, the process may be under way, and a year later, we could say that it's a done deal, there's no turning back, and investments have been made, but then three years later, collateral damages are identified. Is this what I should understand?

[Michael DeJong]

Exemptions in all regulatory sandboxes have to be very narrow.

Also, there's nothing in the bill that can overrule the independence of the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission. Nothing there would allow the minister to overrule the independence and the safety regulations already in place.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

In closing, I would like to make a request. Obviously, you know how I'm going to vote. I don't have any answers, I don't have any criteria, and I don't have anything that gives me comfort. I'm thinking about the people in my riding who are really concerned, and so I'm asking you to give me something that would reassure Canadians. At this point, it feels as though we've already realized that we'll get a beautiful beach to play on, and that we'll end up with collateral damages yet again. It's not as if the government has been free of scandals since 2015. I have serious concerns with this.

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thanks very much.

We'll go to Mr. Patzer, please.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for joining us here today.

Right off the bat, picking up on a different question that was asked earlier, how many regulations have been either changed or removed because of the regulatory sandboxes that have existed in the transport and health departments for the past six years?

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton—Chinguacousy Park, ON]

For clarity, are you asking about an overall red tape review or particularly for the sandboxes used?

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

It's just for the sandboxes used. You said earlier that there was one used in one of the departments. You didn't specify the other department.

If this has been such a resounding success for the past six years that you have to bring it in for every other department, surely to goodness you can tell us how many regulations have been changed or repealed because of regulatory sandboxes.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton—Chinguacousy Park, ON]

It was just one time that it was used, and in one department. It's in two departments—Transport Canada and Health Canada—but it was used by one department.

If you will allow me, I can ask Bill to give you clarity on how many were removed or not, for your benefit.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

How many?

[Bill Matthews]

I cannot give you an answer as to how many, but we can talk about freight train inspection as one example where the rules were successfully tested and changed.

Mike, is there another one you want to add in the five seconds I've left you?

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

It's been used more than once, then.

[Michael DeJong]

Regulatory sandboxes provide a narrow exemption, as opposed to repealing an entire regulation. The evidence collected in a regulatory sandbox is then used to inform the regulator for subsequent amendments.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

Were there any subsequent amendments, though?

[Michael DeJong]

Yes, absolutely. I can provide some examples.

With respect to, for example, the e-manifest that the secretary mentioned, Transport Canada ran a regulatory sandbox in 2020 to test the use of e-shipping documents—whether they could be used to safely replace paper documents. This allowed Transport Canada to then use that to evolve the transportation of dangerous goods regulations so they were in greater alignment with international standards.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

Thank you very much.

Minister, with the early retirement incentive that is in place, where is the money going to come from for that incentive?

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton—Chinguacousy Park, ON]

That would be from the public service pension fund.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

Is it the overages from it that will be used? The plan still has to be utilized and made whole. Where exactly within that fund is it going to come from?

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton—Chinguacousy Park, ON]

As I said, it's the public service pension fund; it will be coming from there.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

Is it not from the overages?

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton—Chinguacousy Park, ON]

Can you clarify your question, please?

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

The pension fund has done well, and there's extra money there. Normally that would go back into general revenue. Is that money being used to make the taxpayer whole, or is that money going to be used to fund your early retirement buyout?

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton—Chinguacousy Park, ON]

In your question, there's a certain mix-up. What I can say is that money is coming from the public service pension fund to deal with early retirement. If you want a bit more clarity, I can ask my team to respond to that.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Swift Current—Grasslands—Kindersley, SK]

You don't know, though, Minister.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton—Chinguacousy Park, ON]

I'm sorry. I know, but—

[Bill Matthews]

I can be really quick.