Health Committee on June 15th, 2016

[Paul Saint-Denis]

Something along that line would...at least on that score, you would assuredly cover the person who's the victim of the overdose.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Last, I'm going to ask Mr. Parkinson a related question.

I toured the Insite facility in Vancouver, and I've seen the paraphernalia to deliver naloxone. It's in a needle. If you're in an emergency situation, you have to break some glass and get the needle in. I'm just wondering if developing EpiPen technology to deliver naloxone is something we should be looking at. It could be made widely available. Would that also help save lives in this country?

[Michael Parkinson]

It would broaden the appeal of carrying naloxone to a wider variety of people, including first responders such as police and firefighters. That's precisely what's happening in the U.S.A., where there's a variety of formulations available and they're being used. The caveat is they're significantly more expensive than the intramuscular version. I believe there's an application before Health Canada for an intranasal product. That will appeal to those who are squeamish about using needles.

To answer your question, yes, more formulations for naloxone would be helpful. It would also be helpful if provinces started adding naloxone to their drug benefit plans and if the federal government would add it to the Veterans Affairs and the federal formulary, so people could afford it, in light of the Health Canada decision to downscale the regulation.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

What's the difference in price? What does the present formulation cost and what does the EpiPen formulation cost, roughly speaking?

[Michael Parkinson]

We have only the intramuscular version here. If you have an inside line on a bulk buy, you can have it for $1.50 a dose. It's so cheap. It would range up to $13 a dose wholesale through a pharmacy. Retail in Ontario—I'm not sure about other provinces—it's about $45 for two doses, and you'd want to have at least two doses on hand.

The EpiPens in the United States.... EpiPens are for epinephrine. They're basically an auto-injector. That's what you're talking about. They can range up to 600 bucks a pop. That's the rub. But it's up to the pharmaceutical corporation to make that application to Health Canada for approval. Maybe there are some levers that are available to Health Canada to encourage those kinds of applications. Certainly, the opioid epidemic is enticing many manufacturers in the U.S. to apply to the FDA to have those formulations approved and get them out there.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Thanks.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

That's it.

That brings us to the end of our presentations and our questions. I want to thank all the witnesses for coming and giving us such great information.

We are now going to go into a bit of committee work, so we'll just take a break while everybody leaves. I do want to thank you very much for your meaningful presentations.

Thank you, Ms. Padaric, for your contribution.

[Christine Padaric]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

I'm going to call the meeting to order again in camera, with the thought that we're going to talk about potential witnesses for our next sessions.

[Len Webber, Conservative, Calgary Confederation, AB]

Mr. Chair, I didn't think this was going to be in camera, but that this was going to be part of the committee business. I didn't realize that you were going to have this as an in camera discussion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

We have to decide what we're going to do with Bill C-224. We're going to have further witnesses. As to who they are going to be, we're going to talk about people and name the names of potential witnesses.

Dr. Carrie.

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

Mr. Chair, I know you were having a conversation there, and it's taken up some of the committee business time. I believe you need a motion to go in camera, but I thought your policy was that we could do committee business without going in camera.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

It is, but if we're going to talk about potential witnesses and say that this person can come, and this person can't, it's hard to do that not in camera.

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

I'll ask the clerk if we need a motion to go in camera. Clerk, is that your understanding?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

We can go in camera if we have the implied consent, but I don't know....

Yes, Mr. Davies.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Mr. Chairman, I believe that Mr. Webber, Mr. Carrie, and you, are all correct.

As I understand it, at the beginning of this committee, we agreed that it was appropriate to go in camera in the circumstances you talked about, when we're discussing potential witnesses, evidence, and that sort of thing. If Mr. Webber wants to simply move a motion for committee business that we clearly said should be on the record, then there's no reason to go in camera for that. I think it depends on what we're dealing with.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

Let's do Bill C-224 first, if that's all right.

[John Oliver, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

Sure. Fair enough.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

Yes.

[John Oliver, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

What I would worry about is that those [Inaudible—Editor]

I was going to be getting into the business of Bill C-224, so I'll wait until you're through with the procedural matters. I did have a motion to make with respect to Bill C-224.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

Well, we have one witness for Monday, and only one. We have to decide what we're going to do on Monday. Are we going to call more witnesses, or have we had enough testimony? What is the will of the committee? What do you want to do?

Mr. Eyolfson.

[Doug Eyolfson, Liberal, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB]

For my part, I don't know if any more witnesses would have much more to offer on this. We have a good perspective on this bill. We've seen that there are some potential problems with it, but I think we have had compelling evidence to support it at this point.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

Mr. Oliver.

[John Oliver, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

I did hear from all of the witnesses that this is an urgent issue and that lives have been lost that could have been saved if this bill were passed. I am concerned that we're coming to the end of our time as a committee with the House potentially rising next week.

I'd like to put forward a motion that we move to clause-by-clause review on Monday of next week.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bill Casey]

Mr. Davies.