Health Committee on Dec. 12th, 2024

[Eric Costen]

I'd certainly be happy to respond to that request. I'd also be very happy to detail the administrative costs and the arrangements that we have with the—

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

I have a point of order, Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Go ahead, Dr. Ellis.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

I'm not entirely sure what Mr. Costen is giving us as an answer.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Dr. Ellis, if you had the floor, you would be able to ask those questions. That isn't a point of order. You didn't like Dr. Costen's answer and therefore you sought to intervene. I think Mr. Thériault is quite capable of handling himself.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Chair, the point is, again, that we have the opportunity, as you know, to demand documents here, and I don't think Mr. Costen perhaps understood that when that's exactly what Mr. Thériault asked him, so, maybe, Chair, you can make it clear to him.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

You make a valid point that is not a point of order.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

No, I think it is, Chair. It's related to the production of documents, and this witness is skirting the issue.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

I don't accept that as a point of order.

Mr. Thériault, you have the floor.

[Luc Thériault, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Will the contract be made available to us? Will you table it with the committee so that we can see what you agreed to and how we ended up with such failures? Yes or no? When are you going to do that?

[Eric Costen]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I will have to take the request from the committee for access to the contract back and respond in writing.

[Luc Thériault, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Mr. Chair, I am moving a motion to that effect. I want to see the contract. I want Health Canada to table the contract with the committee. We want to see what's in there.

In fact, there is an issue in Quebec. Quebeckers wondered why the RAMQ wasn't in charge. Why didn't you sit down with the RAMQ, which had been managing a program for 30 years? Why give it to Sun Life? The RAMQ could very well have done the work using all the computer systems that were already connected to Sun Life.

You chose Sun Life. We want to see the contract.

Why is it so expensive? Will the current failures increase the administrative costs associated with the contract?

That's why I want to see the contract, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you, Mr. Thériault.

Just to be crystal-clear, Mr. Costen, even though it wasn't a point of order, Dr. Ellis makes a valid point: It is within the power of the committee to compel the production of documents. You've received a request to produce the contract. I expect that you're fully aware that there are consequences if you do not.

The request has been formally made. We would expect a production of the contract or an explanation that will likely be acted upon by the committee if it isn't.

[Eric Costen]

That's understood.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

The last round of questions goes to Mr. Julian.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

It is important to recall for the committee the incredibly dismal record during the Harper reign, when Harper Conservatives refused to ever provide any document of any sort and were covering up their scandals, which was a myriad of billions of dollars misspent. Again, it's a bit strange. When the Conservatives were in power, they were terrible, awful, abysmal, and we never got to the heart of anything. I'm glad that, because it's a minority Parliament, we're able to get to the bottom of things that are important and are in the public interest. We can never go back to the horrible days of the Harper regime.

I want to come back to the questions that I asked, and I thank our witnesses for being here.

I asked the minister about the issue around response time for pre-approval, but it's more properly a question to officials. Do you have that information? Again, this program has been wildly successful everywhere, particularly in Quebec, and right across the country. It's important to know how we can make the program even better.

[Eric Costen]

On the pre-authorization process, it's about a seven- to 10-day turnaround.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

That's with the exception of that problem that was identified by Mr. Thériault.

Thank you.

I want to move on to the pharmacare expert committee that was put in place. I want to know whether the work plan has been established. This was with Dr. Nav Persaud, Dr. Stéphane Ahern, Amy Lamb, Dr. Steve Morgan and Linda Silas.

It's a terrific committee of very respected Canadians. They will be mapping it out by October 10, the deadline being the one-year anniversary of royal assent on the pharmacare bill.

Has that work plan been put into place? Has the committee met?

[Jocelyne Voisin, Assistant Deputy Minister, Health Policy Branch, Department of Health]

The committee has met once. I don't know that they have a full work plan in place yet, but they have met once and there's a plan for them to meet again in January.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

That's terrific.

At this point, do you have any concerns about them meeting that important deadline for rolling out pharmacare on a broader basis?

[Jocelyne Voisin]

I think they're on track to do their work. They have met once already.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

That's terrific.

On the issue around the formulary and the national purchasing strategy, which are both part of the Pharmacare Act that the NDP worked so hard to get through the House and the Senate, has work started on those two aspects as well?

[Jocelyne Voisin]

As laid out in the bill, as you know, the CDA—Canada's Drug Agency—is tasked with leading on that work. They are certainly taking the steps to go forward with that.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

That's terrific.

I want to come back to the issue around Canadians who are being denied the dental plan coverage because they have a non-resident spouse. This has happened quite often. It is something that has an easy fix, I believe. The minister said they're working on it. I want to see what your deadline is for responding to that.

I have constituents who are very excited about the Canadian dental care plan. They want to use it, but currently they're in suspension with their application because they have a spouse who is not a Canadian citizen.

[Eric Costen]

I can elaborate a little bit on what the minister said.

I'm not sure if everyone is aware, but as a part of our eligibility verification process, we have to check family income in order to understand whether the person applying is eligible or not. If a foreign spouse does not report their income in Canada, it makes that process very difficult—almost impossible. Finding a solution to that very specific problem is what we're actively working on. We hope to have a solution as quickly as possible.

We understand that it affects a good number of people. It's very intrinsic to the eligibility verification process, so we're working through the practicalities of how to do that.