Health Committee on Dec. 17th, 2024

[Luc Thériault, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

The fact remains that money was divided up among four priorities, including mental health and addiction, and that another $4.6 billion was added, spread out over the next 10 years, in an attempt to address mental health problems and the toxic drug crisis, among other issues.

As you well know, it's a shared responsibility. I'm pleased to hear you say that. Sometimes, when the committee studies certain issues, all the responsibility is placed on the federal government, when its role is quite modest, after all, compared to the role played by first responders on the ground. Here in committee, we can amend legislation, but the people making a difference are those on the ground who, as I speak, are working to save the lives of people who overdosed.

I think a lot more resources are required. In that sense, has the existence of these bilateral agreements facilitated the flow of funds to the communities? What I've been told about this and what I understand from it is that there has not yet been an agreement with Quebec for funding for youth mental health, for example, and that the funding is still not accessible. In the case of Quebec, the money is slow to arrive in the communities.

I heard your answer. You seem to be saying that you've made a difference by injecting funds. However, I would like to know how your department, in addition to injecting funds, can help resolve this crisis. Money is not enough; I think we agree on that.

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

Through you, Mr. Chair, I want to thank my colleague for the question.

I can tell you that, with the bilateral agreements, there are data points and datasets that we'll be seeing at the conclusion of the first year of the agreements to see where investments have gone and who has been impacted and has received services. It will be a benchmark for us to understand how those funds, specifically in the bilateral agreements, are being used.

I would like to share with my colleague from the Bloc, since he is here representing Quebec and Quebeckers, that I was pleased to join Minister Lionel Carmant in October specifically on the SUAP. As an example, it was $86.8 million in investment to province of Quebec organizations. More than 90 projects were identified in a very collaborative way. I have to say that it really is an example of what happens when jurisdictions work well together to set priorities and meet the needs on the ground with community organizations.

We do know that the funds, particularly in Quebec, are getting to the organizations that are doing that frontline work. We will always work collaboratively with every jurisdiction, whether it's through SUAP, ETF or the bilateral agreements, to make sure that we have provided federal resources to address this crisis, with the expectation that jurisdictions scale to need with the health care services they must meet for their citizens.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you, Minister and Mr. Thériault.

Next we'll go to Mr. Johns, who is online.

You have six minutes.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Thank you so much.

Thank you, Minister, for being here. I particularly want to thank your staff and of course the public servants who are there for the important work they're doing.

Minister, time's running out on this government. It has yet to fulfill its promise to make mental health care a full and equal part of our universal public health care system. A report that was released last month by the Canadian Mental Health Association on the state of mental health in Canada found that the mental health of Canadians is three times worse than before COVID-19. Millions of Canadians still can't access the supports they need. This was clear in that report.

Yesterday's fall economic statement was perhaps your government's last chance to move forward with its promised Canada mental health transfer. Again, it was nowhere to be found. While the economic statement contained $17 billion in new spending for helping business, the government has really abandoned Canadians struggling with their mental health—their communities, their families and, really, our overburdened health care system.

Do you believe all Canadians should be able to access mental health supports with their health card and not their credit card? If so, why has your government not been able to make that a reality after almost a decade in power?

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

Thank you for the question.

I will say this. Since 2015 this government has been committed to making historic investments in the mental health of Canadians. In 2017 $5 billion began to flow to provinces and territories to increase the availability of mental health care, in addition to almost $600 million for distinctions-based mental health and wellness as a key part of the strategy for how we address the needs of indigenous communities across the country.

As I said earlier, $500 million was put down as an investment in budget 2024 for our youth, with an additional $140 million to support veterans. This was also layered into the $200 billion over 10 years to provinces and territories where mental health and substance use is a key component of the principles of those agreements.

As the member well knows, we will continue to provide the investments that jurisdictions must make in their health care systems so that Canadians can access mental health services where and when they need them. We always work collaboratively with jurisdictions and encourage them to put forward priorities that meet the needs in their jurisdictions. That being said, we are always here to do more, but jurisdictions also need to do their part with the funds they've been provided.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Minister, we could have a long conversation about that, but I'll go to the next question.

Basically, in 2013, which is 11 years ago now, the Mental Health Commission of Canada published a report estimating the annual direct and indirect costs of mental health for Canada and making the case for investing in mental health. The report estimated that the annual direct costs of mental health illness for the Canadian health care and social support system would reach $79.9 billion in the year 2021 and $156 billion by 2031. The report also estimated that mental illness cost the economy $6.4 billion in lost productivity—this was back in 2011—and that it would rise to $16 billion by 2041.

Research has shown that investments in mental health produce savings for society, yet Canada continues to underfund mental health. Do you believe there is a fiscal case for increasing investments in mental health, given the economic and social challenges in Canada and what we're facing? If so, why did the fall economic statement not propose those investments?

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

Thank you.

Through you, Mr. Chair, I will agree with the member. Mental health is health. It is a key component of the well-being of Canadians across this country, young and old, which is why the many investments I listed in my previous answer are so important. However, as I mentioned, the provinces and territories are the primary deliverers of our health care systems, and this is why we work with them.

I am a firm believer in section 3 of the Canada Health Act, which states, “the primary objective of Canadian health care policy is to protect, promote and restore the physical and mental well-being of residents of Canada”. We continue to make those investments, and we expect provinces and territories to live up to their commitments under the Canada Health Act as well.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Minister, the government updated the Canadian drugs and substances strategy in 2023, but it contained no real plan with a timeline or resources to respond to the toxic drug crisis. When will we finally see an action plan to mobilize an emergency response and allocate enough resources to finally end this tragic crisis?

You can put the blame on the provinces and territories, but when is a plan coming together to bring everyone together, with money and resources to implement it?

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

Thank you.

Since 2016, this government has put nearly a billion dollars' worth of investments into addressing the illegal toxic drug supply and the overdose crisis. We have always worked, and I will continue to work, with the provinces and territories on the four key principles of the strategy to address the toxic drug supply and the overdose crisis. That means prevention, harm reduction, treatment and aftercare, and community safety. These are all key pillars to this work.

We work with jurisdictions to understand the needs that are local and pertinent to their communities, and respond as jurisdictions ask us to respond with them. Collaboration is the key to this work.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

It's not even close to enough, Minister. It's not even close to enough.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you, Mr. Johns.

Thank you, Madam Minister.

Next is Dr. Ellis, please, for five minutes.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you very much, Chair.

Thanks, Minister, for being here.

Here's a statement: “Alcohol is a leading preventable cause of death, disability injuries, accidents and social problems.” Do you believe that to be true, Minister?

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

I think alcohol is a substance that, unfortunately, is used by too many across this country without an understanding of what its health impacts are. We continue to do that work in prevention and education through the Public Health Agency of Canada.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Minister, I'm not asking you some trap question here. That's from “Canada’s Guidance on Alcohol and Health: Final Report”.

It's a simple question. Do you believe alcohol is a leading preventable cause of death, disability injuries, accidents and social problems?

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

I believe the abuse of alcohol consumption can be detrimental to one's health.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Okay. I can see the game you want to play today. On behalf of Canadians, Minister, that's very sad.

The other thing that's incredibly sad is that your government put forward a temporary tax trick on Canadians, which includes temporarily removing—for two months—the GST on beer, wine and “ready to drink” alcoholic drinks.

How did it make you feel, Minister, when that came across your desk?

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

The GST tax break for Canadians was meant to address—and does address—affordability concerns that many Canadians across the country have shared with us. In responding to that, after listening to Canadians, particularly during the holiday season, we wanted to ensure that they were able to have a break during this time, when they're gathering to celebrate.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Minister, by reducing the price, your government is promoting the consumption of alcohol. Is that not true?

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

The GST tax break is for Canadians to make a choice of what goods they wish to purchase to enhance their holiday season.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

What I would say to you, Minister, is that the member from Kanata—Carleton made an interesting video quite clearly encouraging Canadians to drink alcohol, showcasing a bottle of wine. Is that not true?

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

I believe the Leader of the Opposition has been in multiple videos grabbing a beer with folks and promoting it, as well.

I'm not really sure what the point of your question is.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Minister, one of the most effective ways we have to help Canadians.... Is it not true that, again...?

Why didn't you include cigarettes in that? Why did you not reduce the taxes on them? Why would you, as a member who represents mental health and addictions in the failing government, think it's a good idea, on behalf of Canadians, to reduce the GST on beer, wine and “ready to drink” alcoholic drinks?

Explain that to Canadians. It's a simple question.

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

Through you, Chair, I believe I answered the question with regard to the GST tax break for Canadians to address needs of affordability.

Our office of mental health and addictions—as well as the associate minister of health—ensures we provide resources for prevention so Canadians can make healthy choices no matter what they eat or consume. This is the work we do in the federal government.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Minister, did your department have any input on this policy? Did you know this was going to happen, or did they do it behind your back?

[Ya'ara Saks, Liberal, York Centre, ON]

The GST tax holiday for Canadians is to address affordability.