Health Committee on Jan. 18th, 2022

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Thank you, Minister Duclos. You answered my question.

In that case, why are you rejecting the opinion of Prime Minister Trudeau's own chief science advisor, who says that random screening should be reintroduced at airports?

Why aren't you following Dr. Tam's recommendation? She considers that, in terms of PCR tests at the border:

“it is a capacity drain on the system as a whole”.

These are clear recommendations, Minister Duclos.

Are you continuing to test people against the current scientific opinions because you signed a contract with Dynacare for almost half a billion dollars and you can't terminate it?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Québec, QC]

I'd say that we have two major advantages in Canada. The first is that we're surrounded by scientific experts, who have inspired and guided us since the beginning of the COVID‑19 pandemic. Science is guiding our response to COVID‑19—

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

So why aren't you listening to your scientists, such as Dr. Tam, whom we listen to every time she provides advice, and Dr. Mona Nemer, the Prime Minister's chief science advisor?

They're all telling us that PCR testing at airports should be changed. The science is evolving. It's now saying that we should change the amount of testing, which is no longer manageable.

Understandably, the nearly half‑billion‑dollar contract awarded to Dynacare just before the holidays means that the company must test everyone as they arrive.

Is there a connection between this contract and the fact that you aren't changing your opinion based on the recommendations of scientists?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Québec, QC]

Since you cut me off earlier, I'll finish what I was saying.

Our second advantage is that we live in Canada, where we have exceptional tools that include vaccination, border measures, testing, rapid testing, personal protective equipment and public health measures. In addition, in Canada, we trust the institutions and scientists.

We must do so while working together to keep up our efforts in the coming months, as we emerge from the COVID‑19 crisis.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Unfortunately, you aren't listening to the opinions of your experts.

I'll give the floor to Mr. Ellis.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

You've got about two and a half minutes left, Dr. Ellis. Go ahead.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Mr. Berthold.

Mr. Minister, last week you were invited by the ethics committee—you and Dr. Tam were, sir—to appear for their study about the government collecting Canadians' cellphone data.

To you and to Dr. Tam, when will you be appearing, both of you?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Québec, QC]

There are three things on that.

First, the protection—

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

No, no, no—all I need is a date, sir.

[Adam van Koeverden, Liberal, Milton, ON]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Go ahead, Mr. van Koeverden.

[Adam van Koeverden, Liberal, Milton, ON]

Mr. Ellis continues to not allow the minister to answer the questions. It's not only disrespectful; it's also impacting the answerability of his questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Mr. Van Koeverden, thank you for that. The general rule of thumb is that the witness is allowed as much time to answer as questioner takes to pose the question. Generally, Mr. Ellis's questions are very quick. He is right to cut off the witness after allowing an equal amount of time.

Mr. Ellis, I'll add to your time. You go ahead.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you, sir. I appreciate it.

Simply a date, sir—that's all I need. When will you be appearing before the ethics committee, Minister and Dr. Tam?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Québec, QC]

I'll be even shorter. I'll just let you know that I'll be pleased to be at whatever occasion, with my officials, we need to be at to be helpful to you as members of important committees of the House.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Do you not know when you're going?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Québec, QC]

As I said, I'll be pleased to be there at whatever moment is appropriate and convenient for busy people like you and important people like you.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Dr. Tam, do you know when you'll be there, ma'am?

[Dr. Theresa Tam]

I think the Public Health Agency will be there to support the minister on whichever date has been decided. Just for the record, I'm not actually directly involved in the program. For it to be useful to the committee, the Public Health Agency will propose the most suitable witnesses.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you very much, ma'am.

Just to follow up on that, Dr. Tam talked about a mental health app. Should Canadians be concerned about their cellphone data, and again their personal health data, while using the mental health app the Canadian government has now proposed, given this scandal associated with data collection behind their backs?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Québec, QC]

On mental health data, that's obviously part of a different department.

Maybe Dr. Tam or DM Lucas has something to contribute on that question.

[Dr. Stephen Lucas]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

The process taken to competitively determine the service provider for the Wellness Together portal and the subsequent app developed was rigorous. It involved consideration of all dimensions, including privacy protection and security. The service providers have a long track record in providing health services. We're confident they're taking the steps necessary to ensure that protection.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you, Dr. Lucas.

Thank you, Dr. Ellis.

Next is Dr. Powlowski. Go ahead, please, for five minutes.

[Marcus Powlowski, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Rainy River, ON]

Hello. Thank you. Welcome to all the witnesses.

I want to ask the minister something, but of course he's welcome to delegate the answer to someone else. I think for this one it would probably be Mr. Thompson. I want to ask about other therapeutics and the difficulty Canadian doctors have in accessing them.

Certainly I think everyone is overjoyed that Paxlovid has been approved in Canada. It seems to be really promising, with more than 85 per cent efficiency in decreasing the number of people either hospitalized or dying.

We did have medications out there before that were pretty good, when used early on, to treat high-risk people, namely monoclonals—one of my favourite topics, of course—and sotrovimab. I know they've also been using some remdesivir, but it's in very short supply. I'm told by infectious disease people in Ontario—and I know it's the province that basically runs the hospitals—that a lot of people aren't getting it. Similarly, tocilizumab, supposedly decreases mortality by 10% in people who are on ventilators, but there's not a lot of that available. Although this is provincial, my understanding is that the federal government has put some money into purchasing monoclonals and helping the provinces with these treatment modalities.

Could you, Mr. Minister or one of your people, answer that?