Health Committee on Dec. 4th, 2025

[Burton Bailey, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

Madam Chair, I'm trying to be polite because there's been some real friction. I'm really trying to be polite, not rude. I'm trying to be a gentleman, if that strikes any chords with you.

When I put my hand up, I was polite and allowed the Bloc.... Because this is their study, I felt it was very important that she had an opportunity to discuss what she needed to. Then, of course, you recognized Mr. Mazier, who is the vice-chair, and I thought the clerk had acknowledged my hand up and patiently waited.

Again, I don't want to come across as pushy, but I would like to discuss the motion I made and why it is not happening on Tuesday like we agreed on.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I don't understand your question.

[Burton Bailey, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

I am asking about the motion that I passed that we were going to have the minister here on December 4 or December 9. To say that it's going to happen after Christmas I feel is not acceptable. I think Canadians want answers. Dan listed the questions we have. These things need to be addressed now, not in the new year.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I think we were discussing that. Mr. Mazier spoke to it. A couple of people spoke to it. The minister has been informed and the minister cannot make the date you gave her, because ministers have a lot of other duties. There's nothing we can do about it. I know you may not like it, but the bottom line is that the minister is not able to make that date.

[Burton Bailey, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

Not by Zoom? Not by having any of the department come to answer some of these questions, to start the process? We're just going to let it go into the new year?

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I did not say it would go into.... I do not have the answer on the minister's schedule. The minister was duly sent the letter that we send when these motions pass. She was asked to come on that date. We heard from her that she's unable to make that date. Given that the House may rise on the...well, I don't know—

[Maggie Chi, Liberal, Don Valley North, ON]

On a point of order, Madam Chair, I don't know that the clerk has heard back. I think that's a misconception. I don't think you've heard back from the minister. I think they are trying to work really hard to get the minister to come on short notice.

Have you heard back? I don't believe so.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Put it this way: I don't know that we've heard back for that date particularly. It's always up to the minister to respond and let the clerk know. She may yet be able to come on Tuesday. I have no idea.

Ms. Sidhu.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Madam Chair, I want clarification on one thing. Is there committee business we are discussing today? Is there any schedule? We just listened to testimony.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

No, it's not committee business. We had a problem today whereby we were left with only two witnesses. I think the clerk wanted to explain why we're not getting witnesses and why we have problems with interpretation, because she has a bit of a problem getting the equipment to people on time. Dr. Weiss couldn't get equipment on time. He would have liked to come. I wanted the clerk to explain some of the challenges she has in getting us a full slate of witnesses and getting witnesses to be effective virtually.

Also, Mr. Mazier asked a question about when PHAC officials are coming on Tuesday and what they are coming on; I think that was answered.

That's all that went on. It was not a business meeting at all; it was the clerk giving information, and she was asked a couple of questions.

Ms. Chi.

[Maggie Chi, Liberal, Don Valley North, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I believe we were considering my motion. I don't know how we got derailed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

We are going to because it's now one o'clock.

Because Ms. Chi moved a motion, we are going to have to vote on that. There is no debate.

[Burton Bailey, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

I thought I had the floor. I didn't even finish my statement to you about how on the 10th, all of these budgets.... With this study that we've done, if we don't get to see the minister before the 10th, it will go to the House and we're going to miss out on that whole portion of this study.

I misunderstood you, Chair, and I apologize. I thought you indicated to this committee that we would see her in the new year. Maybe you were speaking to something else.

If you tell me there is still hope that the minister will appear here before December 10, which would be on the 4th or the 9th, prior to this going to the House, I will thank you and cease to speak any more, but I am not going to give up the floor until everyone realizes why I'm pushing for this motion. I moved the motion because we want to take this study to the House, and we cannot do it without speaking to the minister about these monies that we have questions about.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Mr. Bailey, you were very clear about your intent. We understood it. Nobody is debating with you. This motion was passed unanimously by the committee, so no one is trying to block it. It is a matter of the minister not knowing....

The parliamentary secretary to the minister said the minister is working hard to try to make it. That's all we can go on. I have no further information for you, nor does the clerk or anybody here. The parliamentary secretary said the minister is aware and is working hard to try to make it before we rise.

[Burton Bailey, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

Can I ask one last thing? Can the clerk make it known that we...?

I should put together some wording for the clerk to give to the minister, because I feel that if this doesn't happen before December 10, this study will have to be restarted.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Do you mean this particular study?

[Burton Bailey, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

If we cannot discuss all of the spending prior to the 10th, then....

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I'm sorry. I am not able to do anything about this or speak to it. When a minister is called on the estimates—this is very traditional—they are well aware and they try very hard to come. That's all I can tell you, I'm afraid.

Ms. Chi.

[Maggie Chi, Liberal, Don Valley North, ON]

Mr. Bailey, I would suggest that the clerk reach out again. Would it be okay that we, as a committee, send the message again?

I know the minister is trying really hard to work out a schedule, and we haven't heard a yes or a no yet. If we can reach out again to say we're inviting her, would that be acceptable, Mr. Bailey?

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Absolutely. The clerk is always waiting for answers from people. She continues to ask some of the questions for answers about timing and when they can come. It's a given that the clerk is always doing that. We're waiting to hear from the minister's office. That's the only thing I can say. There is nothing else I can do.

Mr. Mazier.

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Riding Mountain, MB]

Thank you, Chair.

The point is that Tuesday is the deadline. It's the last time we're meeting before the supplementaries get cut off. We need to talk about spending. I think everyone is in agreement on that.

Tuesday's meeting will be about spending. That's what we're requesting, as per the motion. If the minister makes it, that's a bonus, but the department should be here, full-court press at least, to discuss spending, as per the motion request.

Whether the minister makes it or not is totally up to her. She'll have to account for that, but we need the department, at least, and we need to talk about spending on health care in Canada.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Okay. So we will have—

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Riding Mountain, MB]

It's because of the supplementary estimates deadline. That's why the deadline was there.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Ms. Sidhu.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Madam Chair, CIHR and PHAC are coming related to this study. They are coming on Tuesday. We still have Thursday. We have said that the minister is working hard on that.

We sent this invitation to PHAC, and on Tuesday the officials are coming related to this study. We can always discuss Tuesday when the minister is coming. Maybe the minister will give us the date. We sent the invitation and she didn't say no. She's working on her schedule.