Could I just comment on the general direction you're going in here? I just went to a conference last week on crime reduction strategy. Well, it sounded like the same conference on poverty reduction strategy. All of these have so many common threads, whether it's crime or education, why aren't these kids staying in school, blah, blah, blah. There are addiction problems, FAS/FAE problems that are undiagnosed, learning disabilities. All of these things contribute. Of course, poverty is the most obvious determinant of poor health, low education, and all of that stuff.
The problem we keep bumping up against always is structural. It's the silos of the government that make it virtually impossible to work holistically with people who have a range of issues, and trying to beat on every door. That's why we're tired. That's why we're played out and exhausted, because you can get this program here and this program there and this program from this level.... Oh yeah, we want training, but you can't call it training if you're talking to the feds because they devolved training to the province. So we can only talk about training to the provincial government. When we talk to the feds, we have to say life skills.
Learning all this stuff, it really wears you down when you're a volunteer—and even when you're not a volunteer, but somebody like Donna, who spent her working life on the poverty line, probably working in a non-profit organization that struggles with all these issues every day.