Evidence of meeting #33 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was community.
9:15 a.m.
Conservative
Maurice Vellacott Conservative Saskatoon—Wanuskewin, SK
I want to read the book you're going to write about your life story.
9:15 a.m.
Coordinator, Brampton Neighbourhood Resource Centre
I've already written a book.
9:15 a.m.
Conservative
Maurice Vellacott Conservative Saskatoon—Wanuskewin, SK
I'd like to read it.
I was intrigued as well by the comments of Reverend Berresford, and I know Shawn would have some comments about the others. But in terms of the fundraising, you made a comment, Ron, in respect of something to the effect of fundraisers being brought in at the beginning. I know food banks have to raise a whole lot of money too, as do the other organizations. It's key. It's kind of at the heart of what you do.
What did you mean by that, fundraisers being brought in at the beginning?
9:15 a.m.
Rev. Ronald Berresford
I'm involved with a group in Barrie, for example, that's looking to put up a permanent centre along the lines of what they did in Cambridge. We've been at this for a number of years now. You need to get the key driving person to put the thing together, and it hasn't happened so far.
On my last visit there, two or three people who have done a number of major projects in the city have said they've decided they're going to get this thing built. They're going to put together a plan. There are people who are already involved in local municipal politics, some town councillors. There's also a retired banker who's going to run the fundraising campaign. You have to get all the parties involved, the political people and the business people. You have to find the right people, people who can get the job done. Some people have a gift for raising money. You need to do that right from the start.
Patrick Brown, the MP there, keeps telling us, “Bring me a plan.” He wants to help, but he wants to see the plan. You have to show people a picture with a building. You have to show them your team, and then you work together with the government.
We did it before in Barrie. We had a program for training at-risk youth. We had a community group together, with the community college, the school board, and so on, and we got money through HRDC. We ran three classes that were highly successful. We taught basic carpentry skills.
9:20 a.m.
Conservative
Maurice Vellacott Conservative Saskatoon—Wanuskewin, SK
So you're saying there was a variety of levels of broad-based support in the community.
9:20 a.m.
Rev. Ronald Berresford
Yes, if you build a team right from the start, then your chance of success is better.
9:20 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Dean Allison
Thank you.
I'm going to give the floor back to Ms. Minna before we wrap up.
9:20 a.m.
Liberal
Maria Minna Liberal Beaches—East York, ON
I'm going to go back to my model, because I think we need a national strategy. For me, that's not an issue; it's more how we go about it. One of the things I want to look at is what I call the tax expenditures. I mean the child care tax credits and all of those tax expenditures. If you add up all the tax expenditures, or these tax breaks or whatever...these are not income taxes but the tax varies. Some of them are for business. But some are social—they mean to deliver social services, but whether they're hitting the mark or not is never determined. If they were refundable taxes, they would make a difference, but they're not refundable at this point. Have any of you looked at the tax expenditures? Would you eliminate most or all of them and fold them into a direct income support structure, as opposed to working through the tax system? These are quite expensive right now.
9:20 a.m.
Member, South Etobicoke Social Reform Committee
You have to be careful when you distinguish between tax credits and tax benefits. Tax credits don't help lower-income people. You have to spend the money before you get it back.
9:20 a.m.
Liberal
9:20 a.m.
Member, South Etobicoke Social Reform Committee
That does not help reduce poverty. Tax credits just don't help.
As far as tax benefits are concerned—
9:20 a.m.
Member, South Etobicoke Social Reform Committee
Anyway, I just wanted to make that clear.
9:20 a.m.
Liberal
9:20 a.m.
National Co-ordinator, Campaign 2000
Let's be specific. The UCCB is ineffective. It is $100 a month. Of course, people appreciate money in their pockets. But if one looks at its goals, one sees that it's not really delivering child care services. In most situations, there are not services to buy, and it's not enough to assist in buying services.
Let's look at it as an income transfer, which is what it is. I would suggest that it needs to be “reconciled” with the child benefit, which is progressive. That means that the lower the income you have, the more benefit you have; the higher the income, the less the benefit. It goes all the way up to about a $95,000 income. It's a small benefit in relation to the cost of raising children, which is important for our society. I think we have to look again at the UCCB, and also we look again at the new Canada child tax credit, the little one that I believe was announced in the 2008 budget, which also has no rationale in tax terms.
It is important to look at poverty reduction measures, but you also have to recognize the cost of raising children. I don't want to imply that we don't think that's important. It is important. Most of the European countries have some form of universal child benefit to assist a wide range of families. Some things can be done that will make the tax measures more effective, more equitable than they are now.
9:25 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Dean Allison
Thank you.
That's all the time we have right now. I want to thank the witnesses for—
9:25 a.m.
Rev. Ronald Berresford
Could I tell one quick story of how we can spend the money better?
9:25 a.m.
Rev. Ronald Berresford
I was in the hospital one day, sitting with a chap who had been stabbed twice by his girlfriend the night before. That's one of the things we do. There was this screaming that broke out. Throughout the whole place you could hear this screaming. This was in the general hospital in Barrie. I went down the hall and there was a chap, one of my boys, who was off the roof on drugs. There were at least eight people around him—an emergency room is not the place for people coming off drugs.
One of the key recommendations in my report is that we have medical detox and detox centres. This could be done with a nurse practitioner. Emergency rooms in a hospital are no good for somebody coming off drugs. That's one of the things I've been advocating for a number of years. Perhaps we could use foreign doctors while they're getting their credentials.
9:25 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Dean Allison
Most definitely.
Thank you, witnesses, once again.
The meeting is adjourned.