You know, working with multi-levels of government is totally possible. We're not needing to reinvent the wheel on any of this stuff. We had the answers. We just stopped using them. We cancelled policies that were working.

We took money out of budgets. I don't know why. It didn't go away; that money still exists.

We're not reinventing the wheel on any of these issues. We know exactly what to do and how to do it. We just have to do it.

I just want to respond quickly both to Tony and to Michael.

Michael, you asked about EI. Get rid of the wait period. Just get rid of it. We already know that most Canadians live paycheque to paycheque. You need that cheque the first time you walk into the EI office.

If you qualify for it, you should leave with a cheque on your first day of walking in those doors, and then people will be back to work in two weeks. But when you have to wait two weeks, now you're down to: “I can't look for a job because I don't have bus fare and I haven't been able to do my laundry in two weeks”. So now you can't look for work until you get that cheque...blah, blah, blah. It rolls on.

Tony, you were asking about...? I've completely derailed myself.

4 p.m.

NDP

Tony Martin NDP Sault Ste. Marie, ON

The basic income.

4 p.m.

Community Advocate, Hospitality Project

Robyn Kelly

Yes, the basic income; I think it's a great idea and we should do it yesterday.

You mentioned a link to homelessness. It won't help homelessness in Vancouver right now. We simply don't have houses for people to live in. We'd have to build houses.

4 p.m.

Liberal

Michael Savage Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS

Can I just make one comment particularly for the benefit of Robyn, but for others, too?

4 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Dean Allison

Sure.

4 p.m.

Liberal

Michael Savage Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS

The Senate has done its own anti-poverty study. I don't know if you appeared before them. Their report is in draft form, and I think they're calling for a basic income for persons with disabilities, as a start. I think if you're going to make a start, that's a good place to begin.

Thanks, Mr. Chair.

4 p.m.

Community Advocate, Hospitality Project

Robyn Kelly

Absolutely.

Everybody has talked a little bit about how much it costs when someone is homeless as opposed to somebody who's leading a healthy and balanced life in society.

I just want to close by telling you about my first client. She was maintaining herself on a $500 employable person's income from welfare. She was an injured nurse, so she retired early and she had a WCB income of $300, which welfare was topping up. One of her roommates bailed; she was paying $800 for an apartment and her roommate left with no notice. She needed $400. She could advertise for a roommate without being under threat of eviction. Welfare rejected that request.

So for the want of $400, 18 months later I stopped calculating at $150,000 the amount we had spent to shelter this woman. That is just sheltering her. She is still not properly housed. She's taking up space that is in fact designated for someone who is recovering from an addiction, which she is not. But it doesn't include any of the money.... For instance, her mental and physical health declined to such a state that she's now drawing a disability pension from the provincial government.

I could go on and on with all the money that isn't calculated in that figure. But in 18 months we spent $150,000 to shelter one individual rather than give her $400 so she could stay in her home.

So those are the numbers I know.

4 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Dean Allison

All right.

4 p.m.

Director, Emergency Services, Lookout Emergency Aid Society

Irene Jaakson

That reminds me of the Vancouver police department report that came out about a year and a half ago. The name has completely gone out of my head, but I'll think about it as I'm driving home.

At any rate, they identified the amount of time they spent responding to downtown east side calls that were related to mental health issues or addictions issues--they look the same sometimes--such as somebody who was causing a kerfuffle outside the door of somebody's shop or being a sort of kamikaze pedestrian and walking in and out of traffic, and so on. The amount of money spent by the VPD to respond to those calls was extraordinarily high. I don't remember the figure. I think the percentage they identified was over 80%.

4:05 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Dean Allison

Listen, we want to thank the witnesses once again for being here. We heard some unique things here again today. It's always great when we have the expertise of people on the ground to talk about what matters and what's important.

We thank you for the hard work you do, because you're on the front lines. If there's some way we can help to shape government policy, we certainly want to do that so we have a better Canada as we move forward.

Again, thank you for being here today.

With that, the meeting is adjourned.