Human Resources Committee on Oct. 4th, 2011

[Bayla Kolk]

Part II of the Canada Labour Code, health and safety.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

This is an area they will be briefing us on, so you're certainly entitled to ask questions as you see fit.

[Claude Patry, NDP, Jonquière—Alma, QC]

Do you take care of the salaries of temporary foreign workers? Do you check to make sure their working conditions and salaries are equal, similar or inferior to those of Canadian workers?

[Marie-Geneviève Mounier]

No, I think this would be also outside of the scope of....

That is not part of our responsibilities.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

Carol, do you want to carry it through? Go ahead.

[Carol Hughes, NDP, Algoma—Manitoulin—Kapuskasing, ON]

I want to pick up on a couple of things. You talked about compassionate care leave and sick leave, and I was wondering about the very limited scope on the sick leave. I believe it's 12 weeks, is it not?

[Bayla Kolk]

Again, we include these in our labour standards, under part III, but the actual rules and technicalities are split between HRSD and Service Canada in terms of benefits and policy guidance.

While we cover the conditions in the workplace and ensure that people are conforming to this, we are not the ones who set the policy direction or actually do the payments.

[Carol Hughes, NDP, Algoma—Manitoulin—Kapuskasing, ON]

But in the Canada Labour Code it does say 12 weeks, does it not?

[Bayla Kolk]

I'll have to check on that.

[Carol Hughes, NDP, Algoma—Manitoulin—Kapuskasing, ON]

Oh, you're not sure. Okay. I was just wondering, because 12 weeks is not a long period of time to have their jobs safeguarded when people have significant illnesses.

[Bayla Kolk]

Yes, that is correct. I have it confirmed.

[Carol Hughes, NDP, Algoma—Manitoulin—Kapuskasing, ON]

Again, I want to interject on that and talk about the fact that 12 weeks isn't a long period of time when someone has a serious illness—for example, they are going through cancer treatments.

I'm not sure if you would have the answer, but I was wondering whether there has been any discussion about extending that, given the serious illnesses out there at this time.

[Bayla Kolk]

I'm not aware of that right now because of it being a policy from HRSD, but I would say that the compassionate care was a response to understanding that a lot of people are faced with aging parents or sick children and how to bridge them with a new benefit.

Generally, having worked in HRSD, I know there is a constant evaluation of programs and a constant thinking about what would be appropriate to respond to current circumstances.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

Your time is up.

We'll move on to the next questioner. Who is that going to be?

Brad Butt, go ahead.

[Brad Butt, Conservative, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

Thank you very much for being here. I'm a new member of Parliament, so it's nice to get a briefing and get a better idea of what the department is doing.

You're probably most famous for your incredible role and the great work you've done, I guess more behind the scenes, with some of the labour disputes that even Parliament has had to deal with since we've been here. Maybe you could spend a bit of time, obviously without divulging confidentiality and secrets and all the other things you do.... What role does your department play in federally regulated industries like Canada Post, Air Canada, etc., when the parties are obviously trying to negotiate a collective agreement? We encourage the parties to do that and reach their own agreement, one they both can agree on. But we do know that from time to time they're not able to do that, or they need some help in moving them along.

Can you give the committee a better idea of the role you play in that, either when you are asked to come in or when you initiate contact with the parties to say you'd be prepared to come in and be helpful, through mediation or some other services that you're providing?

[Marie-Geneviève Mounier]

Thank you very much for the question.

Yes, indeed, we rely on a very professional team of mediators and conciliation officers in the program.

The first thing that happens in a collective bargaining process is that either the employer or the union gives a notice to bargain to the other party, and that would be direct bargaining. There is no time limit; they can take the time they wish to bargain. Then after a period, if they see that they are not going to be able to bargain by themselves, they can file a notice of dispute with the minister. The minister has 15 days to appoint a conciliator. Then for 60 days the conciliation officer will work with the parties, trying to facilitate, and have a process in place for both parties to address their issues. This period can be extended, but that needs the mutual agreement of both parties.

After 60 days, if the parties don't agree to extend, it's the determination of the conciliation, and then there's a 21-day cooling-off period. During that period we appoint a mediator to help the parties, because discussions continue to happen during the cooling-off period. After 21 days the parties acquire the right to strike or to a lock-out.

That is, in a nutshell, how the federal conciliation and mediation services are there to support the parties in their discussions and negotiations.

[Brad Butt, Conservative, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

As a follow-up to that, it was unfortunate, but it had to be done--at least it was our view that it had to be done--and we legislated an end to one of the work stoppages back in June.

When Parliament does that, a bill is passed, and we still need a collective agreement; we need a resolution among the parties. What role does the department play after that has happened to make sure there is an agreement reached, a new contract reached between the employer and the union in that case? What role--post the legislated back-to-work concept--do you play then?

[Marie-Geneviève Mounier]

After that part is done, our role is over. For instance, the minister would appoint an arbitrator, and then the arbitrator would work with the parties to get to an agreement. And there are different types. There's the binding final offer, for instance, where the arbitrator has to choose between one or the other offer. There's another mechanism that allows the arbitrator to choose parts of one offer and parts of another offer and make up a new collective agreement.

The federal conciliation and mediation services in these circumstances are not involved. It's a totally independent process. It's in the hands of the arbitrator, who is appointed by the minister.

[Brad Butt, Conservative, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

I have one last question on that. My time will probably be up, Mr. Chair.

How many times a year would you likely get involved in that kind of thing? Is it fairly frequent, or is it very seldom that you have to play that kind of role, year to year? Is it fairly intensive? Is it happening quite a bit? Or is it that most parties settle on their own and don't require your services and it's once in a blue moon that you folks need to play this role?

[Marie-Geneviève Mounier]

I'm just giving a rough figure, because I don't have the exact figure. I would say that approximately 300 collective agreements are being negotiated each year. I would say that of these, over 90% end without a work stoppage of any kind.

[Brad Butt, Conservative, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[Marie-Geneviève Mounier]

If you want some more key statistics, I have some numbers. For instance, last year the total caseload for 2010-11 was 302 collective bargaining disputes handled. That gives you an idea of the scope.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

Thank you.

Your time is up again, so we'll move to Mr. Cuzner for five minutes.

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Thanks very much, and thank you, ladies, for being here today and for sharing your presentation with us.

I'll throw in two questions that sort of come off what Mr. Butt has asked.

In tough economic times, it's not unusual to have an increase in labour disputes. Is there a strategy in place to maybe address this with regard to access to conciliation and access to arbitration? Is there a strategy you people have in place to address this? Do you anticipate an increase?

[Marie-Geneviève Mounier]

Thank you for the question.

I think there are some cyclical effects. The collective agreements come to an end, and they need to be negotiated, so there's a cyclical effect there. One thing we are doing, and it was announced in budget 2011, is increasing preventive mediation services, which is another key activity of the federal conciliation and mediation services. They try to do workshops and training to help the parties develop their skills so that they are able to resolve issues and get better at negotiating together. Budget 2011 announced an increase of $500,000, which will allow us to do a lot more on that front within our federal jurisdiction.