Human Resources Committee on April 16th, 2013

[Frank Smith]

Perhaps I could respond to that.

I think I mentioned in my presentation that since 2005 we've held 25 what we call “strategies to employment” events—previously, “job search strategies” events—right across the country. In some cases we've been in one city two or three times. These events are all about successful transition from school to work.

The audience is post-secondary students and recent graduates with disabilities. They interact in these forums with representatives from private sector employers, with career and employment centre counsellors who work on the campuses with employment agencies. All the issues that have been presented at the table here and have been discussed by the committee have been discussed in that context, in terms of when to disclose, whether to disclose, how accommodation should be provided, and what are the rights that a person with a disability has in a workplace.

Getting back to some comments that were made earlier, it's not really very useful in a lot of ways to.... We're a cross-disability organization, so to look at individual disabilities and focus on them specifically is not our approach. We figure that when our members graduate from a college or university program, they are qualified to move into the Canadian labour market. What they need is a chance.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

Thank you, Mr. Smith.

Ms. Brayton, do you have a short closing comment? Go ahead.

[Bonnie L. Brayton]

Thank you.

In respect of the reality that the government has made commitments, you've heard from a lot of us about the EI sick benefits. I understand the government's concern about cost and what the cost would be with the change in EI sick benefits. But I think it's important to understand the cost benefits of making this investment in EI sick benefits in the medium and long term. The fact that a significant number of people would be able to stay in the labour market through EI sick benefits changes is a really important thing to consider.

The second thing I would point out is something that Minister Finley put in place under Canada's economic action plan when it was launched—an apprenticeship program for youth with disabilities. We had the benefit of having two of those young people, and I can tell you that this is a really important way to give employers a first-hand opportunity to hire a young person with a disability. It's also an excellent opportunity to provide work experience for young people with disabilities. This was an initiative under Canada's economic action plan in the first budget. I certainly hope that you guys will support the idea of getting Minister Finley to look at that again.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

Thank you for that short concluding response.

We will conclude with Mr. Cuzner.

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

My thanks to all of you for being here today.

My first question is to Mr. Wellar and then I'm going to Ms. Hutchison.

Mr. Wellar, you talked about the segregated wage subsidy programs and the sub-minimum wage jobs. Could you talk about the work being done by those workers now? What should we be doing differently? Could you talk a little bit about that?

Ms. Hutchison, I'll throw the question to you as well. Sometimes when governments make bad decisions, it's not uncommon for one segment of the population to bear a disproportionate amount of the pain, the hurt. When the OAS requirement went from age 65 to 67, I would think you, who represent a group whose unemployment rate usually hovers around 75%, would be at the epicentre of hurt on a change like that. I'd like to know what ran through your mind when you first heard of that, and also what you've heard from the people you network with across the country.

I'll go to Mr. Wellar first.

[Keenan Wellar]

I think this points to why we need a somewhat disability-specific lens, because there isn't any other population that is working in a sub-minimum wage situation. With Ph.D.s who use a wheelchair, there is a law against them working for less than minimum wage, but we've somehow found a way to make this acceptable for certain people.

Where's that happening? Well, here in Ottawa some of the jobs are involved with the recycling of paper. Also, there's a program for watering plants in government buildings. I found most people employed in the federal government were unaware that those individuals are working for a dollar an hour or whatever the current wage is. I would encourage some internal exploration of what's going on there.

The best practice would be to find out how we can directly employ those people as federal government workers, as opposed to this current arrangement. If they need support, that's what an employment support provider is for—to help them get to where they need to be to do the job competently. The “Obstacles” report in 1981 talked about these arrangements, but now it's 30 years later and it's still going on. I realize there are wonderful things happening, but we need to—

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

I think there is a point of order.

[Kellie Leitch, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

I have a point of order. I may have misheard you, and please correct me if this is the case. But I thought I heard the witness say that the federal government was setting wages of, like, a dollar or $1.25. Just so we're clear, the provinces set minimum wages. It is not the responsibility of the federal government to set minimum wages. They're set by the provinces. So I don't appreciate—and maybe I misinterpreted you—the innuendo that the Government of Canada was paying individuals a dollar or $1.25.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

I'm not sure that's a point of order.

I don't know whether you would like to make a clarification, but carry on.

[Keenan Wellar]

Just to clarify, what I'm saying is that there are contractual arrangements whereby there are people on federal properties doing work for very low wages, however that came to be. I realize they're not federal employees.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

Fair enough.

If there is anyone else who wishes to comment, go ahead, and then we'll conclude with that.

Go ahead, Ms. Hutchison.

[Carmela Hutchison]

I know that in some provinces there is legislation that permits the practice that Mr. Wellar referred to, and that does sadly happen. It also happens for people with mental illnesses who are working in psychiatric settings.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

That sort of emphasizes the point made on the point of order, that some of this is regulated by provincial legislation. Nonetheless, we want you to know that we certainly appreciate your taking the time to appear before this committee and to present.

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Mr. Chair, the question I posed to Ms. Hutchison wasn't five minutes. The point of order would have eaten up the time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

I appreciate that.

If you want to respond, we'll conclude with that.

[Carmela Hutchison]

Mr. Cuzner, everyone has been scrambling—and I thank you for this question—to figure out what the impact is going to be. I am caught in the epicentre of this. As a person with a disability, I am the main income earner for my family. I do pay taxes. I have long-term disability insurance and I also have CPP disability.

I am terrified about what will happen to me personally now that the age is increased, and also what's going to happen to all of the women across the country who will live longer and possibly have a long gap between benefits, and also outlive their benefits. This is very much a concern for all of us as we come to grapple with this.

I would hope that we will see perhaps another study on this particular issue, and some interpretations and more dialogue.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Komarnicki]

Thank you very much for that.

Thank you for appearing before this committee and presenting. It's very useful information.

The meeting is adjourned.