Human Resources Committee on May 15th, 2014

[The Chair, Conservative, Phil McColeman]

Yes, Ms. Sims.

[Jinny Sims, NDP, Newton—North Delta, BC]

I heard your ruling earlier about staying close to the estimates, even though we do all wander a little bit from them, so I would ask the chair to use the same lens for all members.

[The Chair, Conservative, Phil McColeman]

I agree. I think that's a fair point, and I'll ask the member to keep on the line of going to the estimates. I sense it's a preamble to getting to where you want to go with estimates.

[Colin Mayes, Conservative, Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Then, Minister, do you have a figure of what that cost is in the estimates for that monitoring, and the sort of work your department does in those trade agreements? There must be some costs.

[Kellie Leitch, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

To be clear for all members of the committee, the labour program has a very robust international program. So I would think—not to direct our Chair, but so that we're all very clear—the labour cooperation agreements that we have negotiated with eight countries, and we are working with 30 additional countries, are an essential part of our free trade agenda and what we're doing. It is an essential part of the labour program so it is, I would think, within our domain.

To the point that you asked, what do we include with respect to what we're moving forward with is a commitment to making sure under the International Labour Organization's Declaration on Fundamental Principles and Rights at Work, the right to free association, the right to collective bargaining, the abolition of child labour, the elimination of forced or compulsory labour, as well as the elimination of discrimination. These are essential components to our labour cooperation agreements that are part of our free trade agenda, the most ambitious trade agenda expansion in our country's history, and are essential component parts. We want Canadians to be on a level playing field, but we also want the countries we're working with to make sure they're increasing and improving their standards if needed. Our labour program works with those countries, with specific organizations, to improve their labour standards.

By way of example, in Honduras and Panama we have an outstanding program of building labour law compliance, making sure their labour standards are improving. In Jordan, we are promoting fundamental principles and rights to work, again making sure that the employees are empowered and understand that they have a right to work and what those rights include, so they are not put at risk.

With respect to the specific number, I'll ask the deputy to make a comment. Then if you have other questions, I'll be happy to take them.

[Hélène Gosselin]

I don't have a cost estimate. We do monitor and implement the labour cooperation agreements, and the funding activities that we undertake are part of that. We do have a labour funding program, which is a line in the estimates, and it's just over $1.7 million dollars in this fiscal year. The vast majority of the labour funding program goes to support the implementation of our international activities in terms of cooperation activities.

[The Chair, Conservative, Phil McColeman]

You have a minute.

[Colin Mayes, Conservative, Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Minister, do you respond? After the agreement is signed and there's an understanding, is there monitoring through maybe responding to complaints or is there a scheduled inspection, this type of thing?

[Kellie Leitch, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

In each one of the agreements that are struck, whether it be a separate labour cooperation agreement or a chapter embedded in a free trade agreement, there is a dispute mechanism. That dispute mechanism exists so that Canadians are well protected. We are making sure Canadians have a level playing field when they're in that environment. This becomes a win-win for Canadian workers. It is an opportunity for us to be expanding the number of jobs in Canada because we're increasing exports and imports, and therefore, increasing a need for maybe the goods that they're producing at their plant, but also, at the same time, making sure that the standards in another country are kept up to Canadian standards.

If there's a concern, individuals can move forward and register their dispute, and then a body will take a look at that. We want to make sure Canadian workers are protected on all levels and Canadian firms and workers have a level playing field in the global economy.

[The Chair, Conservative, Phil McColeman]

Thank you, Minister.

Go ahead, Madam Sims.

[Jinny Sims, NDP, Newton—North Delta, BC]

Thank you very much, Minister. I have a number of questions, Minister. Our time is so limited, so I would really appreciate dense answers as well.

What I want to get down to now is this. The minister has said that the President of the Treasury Board can decide if a job is essential. What is the definition of “essential”, and what is that definition based on?

[Kellie Leitch, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

I guess I will say that, if the question is for the President of the Treasury Board, you may want to ask the President of the Treasury Board.

[Jinny Sims, NDP, Newton—North Delta, BC]

Minister, I think it's more a political question, so that's why I'm directing it to you. Let me just clarify it a little bit more.

I will get to the estimates.

[The Chair, Conservative, Phil McColeman]

I'm listening and I've allowed it, and I keep making the point.

I don't want to have to cut you off and not allow more questioning, but really, members, it's evident that through your questioning and your preambles, you're making certain political points. Really, the minister is not here to answer the broader range of political questions. She's here for the estimates today, so please, get to the point or else I'll have to make a ruling.

[Jinny Sims, NDP, Newton—North Delta, BC]

I appreciate your clarification, Chair. It's just that usually we've had a little bit more latitude than this. I will continue with a round of questioning on what the minister has actually talked about today.

Minister, you've talked a fair bit about the free trade agenda and how much it adds.

The minister did speak about this, so I believe, Chair, it does allow me to pursue that for questions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Phil McColeman]

I'll allow it as long as you can tie it back into the estimates.

[Jinny Sims, NDP, Newton—North Delta, BC]

Yes, I will.

Minister, one of the things you've said is that the free trade agreements you have signed have lead to a “level playing field” for Canadian employers and also have lead to “creating...well-paying jobs”, and I'm quoting you on that. My major concern right here is that, with the numbers we are seeing for employment, there is a growth in part-time jobs.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

I have a point of order, again, Chair.

Again, we're talking about employment. Those were opportunities for when Minister Kenney was here, in terms of those issues.

I think, again, if we could really focus in on the labour program and the main estimates, that would be of value to our discussion here today.

[The Chair, Conservative, Phil McColeman]

We're just rehashing the same points of order. I'm going to allow the minister to respond to this question.

[Kellie Leitch, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

First, I just want to be clear. With respect to the labour market, which is what you're addressing, that is the responsibility of Minister Kenney, the Minister of Employment and Social Development. Our government has been very clear. We're focused and we have been since 2009, at the downturn of the recession, on creating jobs and prosperity for Canadians. We know that over the course of the downturn of the recession until now, we've facilitated the creation of over a million new jobs in Canada. This is exceptionally important. We are the lead in the G-7. It is something that Canadians should be proud of and a reason why our economy continues to move forward.

Now, do we live in a fragile economy? The global circumstance is exactly that. I think we all need to remain diligent, and that's why you've seen this gradual movement by our government to balance our budget and a gradual movement to make sure programs are evaluated well and then implemented, so Canadians have opportunities for employment. Whether those be the new apprenticeship grants that are available to young Canadians, grants and scholarships so they can complete their education, or the Canada job grant, where there's a huge opportunity for Canadians to be provided the training they need to be employed, these are opportunities for Canadians—

[Jinny Sims, NDP, Newton—North Delta, BC]

Minister, I just have one more tiny question, please.

[Kellie Leitch, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

No problem.

[Jinny Sims, NDP, Newton—North Delta, BC]

We talked about the 80% and 20% of the claims that were allowed. What happens to the 20% of claims that were sort of allowed under the old definition, and how are they disadvantaged by the new definition?

[Kellie Leitch, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

Based on the definition of danger, there is no disadvantage to those individuals.

As I mentioned before, any individual, any worker—and I encourage them to if they consider themselves in this circumstance—can refuse work if they find they are in a dangerous circumstance. I would encourage workers to do that. If you're concerned, please move forward. We want to make sure the workplace is safe for you, but also for those other Canadians who may find themselves in that circumstance. We get to evaluate—

[Jinny Sims, NDP, Newton—North Delta, BC]

Thank you.