Human Resources Committee on March 23rd, 2017

[Andrew Brown]

Parental benefits can begin after the child has been born, or in the case of adoptions, when the child has been placed for the purpose of adoption.

The concern is that if benefits were advanced up to 15 weeks in advance of the expected due date, and if the child were to arrive late, another week or two subsequently—if you start at week minus 15, now you've reached week zero—maternity benefits would end and your leave would actually also end. You would be expected back at work because you would not yet be eligible for parental benefits or parental leave.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley—Aldergrove, BC]

I understand your point. Thank you.

I'm sorry again for cutting you off, but there would be no cost to the Government of Canada if 100% of women who qualified chose to use it up. If a portion of them had a pregnancy that went beyond the due date, they would have to wait until delivery, but there would be no net cost if it was calculated based on 100% of those women who qualified using it. There would be no additional cost from moving the 15 months around. Is that correct, based on the assumption that 100% of those who qualify would use it?

[Andrew Brown]

The gap would not incur costs for the EI operating account, but, as I explained earlier, we look at how it's used overall.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley—Aldergrove, BC]

I know. The way you calculate it and the way I'm calculating it I think are different. I think Canadians, if they qualify for it, would like to have it calculated in that way, not based on an actuarial assessment.

I'm probably out of time, too.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

You are, actually. That was really impressive. You got a lot in there.

Mr. Robillard, please, for six minutes.

[Yves Robillard, Liberal, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

If I understand correctly, it is currently possible for a woman to claim EI maternity benefits for eight weeks before the due date while keeping the 15 weeks of benefits. Bill C-243 sought to make it possible for women to take the full 15 weeks prior to their due date if they so wished.

In yesterday's budget, the government opted instead to allow pregnant women to claim EI maternity benefits for 12 of the 15 weeks before their due date and three weeks after the due date.

As a representative of the Department of Employment and Social Development, what is your view on that budget measure?

[Andrew Brown]

I just want to note one little imprecision in that Bill C-243, as presented by Mr. Gerretsen, would allow a woman to start 15 weeks in advance if required and if a doctor agreed that the workplace were unsafe. The government has announced the flexibility to allow a woman to begin her maternity benefits up to 12 weeks in advance, period.

In terms of what's proposed in the budget, I think I can only go as far as to say that it maintains the three weeks. That would still be available after the expected date of birth. That would speak to the specific intent of maternity benefits, which is to help provide income support through leave, time off, to recover and recuperate from childbirth.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Are you sharing your time?

[Yves Robillard, Liberal, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

Yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Mr. Ruimy.

[Dan Ruimy, Liberal, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Thank you again for being here today.

Budget 2017 announced new measures for the flexible maternity benefit for families. Could you again explain to me, briefly, the biggest differences between the former and the new measures? I know it's still soon, but what can you tell us about that?

[Andrew Brown]

Do you mean in terms of what was announced in the budget for parental benefits?

[Dan Ruimy, Liberal, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Yes.

[Andrew Brown]

The way parental benefits currently work in Canada outside of Quebec is that you can access combined maternity and parental benefits for up to 12 months and at the current EI replacement rate, which is at 55% of your average weekly earnings.

What was announced yesterday is that parents would now have an option of taking those benefits over 12 months or over 18 months, if they prefer. They would need to make a choice. If they received them over 18 months, the benefits would be paid at a lower rate. It is approximately the same total amount for either option selected.

[Dan Ruimy, Liberal, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Thank you for that.

You were mentioning gender equity. I don't know if you'll be able to answer this question. Do you see this as helping improve the cause of gender equity when it comes to jobs?

[Andrew Brown]

There are different pieces there. There are the maternity and parental benefits, but overall the package with respect to special benefits—I'll focus on maternity and parental benefits—provides additional flexibility to families so they can select what works best for their family, taking into account their work requirements, family requirements, and perhaps other personal or child care responsibilities.

[Dan Ruimy, Liberal, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Okay, thank you.

With the new rule changes—I'm not pregnant, but let's say he's pregnant—how easy will it be to access the funds and what time frame will it take?

[Andrew Brown]

I would speak to the service standard for processing EI applications, which is to process them within 28 calendar days. I'm not sure of the latest figures, but I know that we have been meeting the target of processing 80% of claims within those 28 days.

[Dan Ruimy, Liberal, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC]

Great. And in the case of somebody who's been deemed by their doctor to be eligible because of a danger to their pregnancy, what requirements are you going to be looking for? Would it take just a doctor's note, or how detailed will that need to be?

[Andrew Brown]

What was proposed was simply to allow women to start maternity benefits sooner. So it would not require something new to come from her or her doctor or primary caregiver. That represents a difference from what is being proposed in Bill C-243. There's the potential that adding new requirements could slow the processing of cases.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Thank you.

Over to MP Sansoucy, please.

[Brigitte Sansoucy, NDP, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Brown, you are providing some very important details that alter my view of the bill entirely. When I was speaking with the bill's sponsor earlier, I said that the government had, in its budget, extended the period from eight to 12 weeks, but not 15. If I understand correctly, however, it does not give any additional weeks of benefits to women whatsoever. When the issue was being debated in the House, Quebec's regime was frequently referenced. I'm talking about the safe maternity experience program, which you also mentioned in your remarks.

The fact is that, in Quebec, the number of weeks a woman takes under the preventive withdrawal program have absolutely no bearing on the 50 weeks of benefits. I was going to ask you whether the additional weeks were being paid out of the EI fund, but I now realize that question no longer applies because there are no additional weeks.

The government announced that it was extending the number of weeks from eight to 12, but that makes absolutely no difference for Quebec. No additional money is being transferred. Yesterday's budget announcement changes nothing. I would ask that you keep your answer brief as I have other questions I'd like to ask.

[Andrew Brown]

It changes nothing in Quebec, where women already have access to maternity benefits sooner than they do in the rest of the country.

[Brigitte Sansoucy, NDP, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

I see.

According to a report by the Institute for Research on Public Policy, improving parental benefits will do nothing to help lower-income families unless EI eligibility requirements are changed. It is a fact that fewer than 40% of workers currently qualify for EI benefits, and that percentage is surely the same for EI maternity benefits.

In other words, a mother who does not qualify for regular EI benefits does not qualify for EI maternity benefits either.

Is that correct?

[Andrew Brown]

Yes, that is correct. It does not change the eligibility criteria or the number of hours worked required to qualify for maternity or parental benefits.