Certainly, having visited several over the course of the past couple of years, my experience suggests that the degree of harassment can vary significantly, not that harassment doesn't happen. I would have to point to Edmonton Institution.
MP Pam Damoff had the occasion to visit a variety of institutions. Certainly I think in the case of the maximum security prison in Edmonton, there was such a profound sense of disconnect. Last week, we had a visit and the warden described it as an island unto itself. It was so profoundly disconnected to the overall CSC culture, which isn't fabulous, quite frankly. There are other institutions where USJE is seeking workplace investigations because we know there is troubling behaviour there too. Yes, it does vary.
Does that suggest that the leadership is only required in Edmonton? I would say absolutely not. I think there's an obvious need for better mechanisms, and I'll let Bethany speak to them because there's a culture-wide feeling but no doubt it has varied.
I think what's remarkable about Edmonton Institution is how long it went on and how fundamental commissioner leadership is. Unfortunately, I'm sad to say it, we didn't have it. The union was often told that they were chasing ghosts, that unless people were putting their names, their personal lives, on the line that investigations were not warranted.
I think that's why this legislation is so valuable, when you're looking at RCMP, CSC, some of these other workplaces. You absolutely need a safety mechanism outside the department. It is also true of Parliament Hill.
Once again, I'm super happy to have a safety mechanism. We want you guys to get it right, because we know we've only got one shot at this right now, apart from a five-year review, and it's important that we make sure we make it as strong as possible.