Evidence of meeting #43 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was men.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Chair, Canadian Men's Sheds Association
At this moment, there are 39. About 1,200 men are involved.
Conservative
Marty Morantz Conservative Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
You established the first one right here in Winnipeg, correct?
Chair, Canadian Men's Sheds Association
Yes. My daughter in Saskatoon learned about Men's Sheds and phoned me and told me to go on a site in Australia. I looked at it and said, “Well, that's interesting”, and she said, “Good. Start one.”
Conservative
Marty Morantz Conservative Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
Now, while I've got you, because my time is limited, I wanted to touch on this. I know you said that in other countries that have men's sheds—in Ireland, Australia, the U.K. and so forth—there are federal supports. What would Men's Sheds like to see from the federal government?
I know you've tried to apply for charitable status a number of times. I wonder if you could talk about that and the other kinds of supports that you think might be necessary from a federal perspective.
Chair, Canadian Men's Sheds Association
For Men's Sheds, the bottom line is mental health. I understand that we have 14 different jurisdictions in Canada. Some of you will say, “No, no, Doug, there are 10 provinces and three territories,” but you also need to throw in the aboriginal national health care program. That's the 14th one.
Under those conditions, it's a very difficult situation to try to get all of the provinces, as you people know, to co-operate and come up with an individual program. However, I think it would be an advantage to have a small national office to advocate on behalf of all the provinces, and as we form more and more provincially based organizations, to be able to take the challenges and the opportunities to people such as you.
Conservative
Marty Morantz Conservative Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
If I have time, Mr. Chair, I just have one quick last question. I think this is the most important question right now for Mr. Mackie. For anyone watching, how do they join Men's Sheds? How do they get involved?
Chair, Canadian Men's Sheds Association
There's a national website. They can go on there. All inquiries end up in my email. I immediately get hold of them. I try to pick up the telephone and call them or do a Zoom meeting with them, but it's a very simple operation. If two or three men get together and want to call themselves a men's shed, we will accept them. There's no national cost.
We like the New Zealand model, as a matter of fact. They pay about $40 a year for each of their 120 sheds.
The one other comment I'd like to make about this, Marty, is that we have different sorts of social get-togethers here in Canada compared with Ireland, which could fit into the bottom half of Manitoba and only has about 450 sheds.
Conservative
Marty Morantz Conservative Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
We have a lot of work to do, clearly.
Conservative
Liberal
Han Dong Liberal Don Valley North, ON
Thank you very much, Chair.
Mr. Mackie, I really enjoyed your jokes in the beginning. I took notes. I'm going to share them with my kids and we're going to have a laugh.
Thank you very much for telling the committee a bit more about Men's Sheds projects. I know some Men's Sheds projects across the country have received New Horizons for Seniors program funding and also the special COVID-19 additional funding that was announced and implemented, which is worth, I believe, $20 million.
It's very important to support projects like this. You're right about the belief in society that men have trouble expressing how they feel or seeking help when they face mental health challenges. We know mental health challenges may lead to serious physical harm. I remember a report by CAMH indicating that over 75% of serious physical harm involved men.
In your opinion, how can these projects or peer support groups combat stigma around mental health, especially when it comes to men in Canada?
Chair, Canadian Men's Sheds Association
Thanks, Mr. Dong, for your question.
On your first comment about New Horizons for Seniors, it doesn't work on a national basis. Other than the one big project every five years.... I have a New Horizons for Seniors grant that ends at the end of this month. There are no Men's Sheds in Saskatchewan, but I cannot take any of the money that I have—and I will expend it all—and go to Saskatchewan to help them open up a Men's Shed. New Horizons for Seniors is provincially mandated. It's to one province. It does not go across provinces. With our kind of situation, I need some funding to be able to go across provinces.
The second thing is that I'd like all of you to look at the New Horizons for Seniors priority 3. Why do I say number 3? I'm going to read only part of it. It says, “Combatting ageism, celebrating diversity and promoting inclusion”. Then it says, “particularly members of underrepresented or underserved groups including but not limited to: women, Indigenous Peoples, persons with disabilities, members of racialized and newcomer groups, and members of the LGBTQ2+ communities”.
I want you to note that I can find no place within New Horizons for Seniors with any mention of programs or opportunities for men, period.
Liberal
Han Dong Liberal Don Valley North, ON
I appreciate that input.
You mentioned different levels of government needing to work together to provide that support. In your opinion, how does that look in terms of creating more outreach initiatives from the government to support peer-to-peer support groups?
Chair, Canadian Men's Sheds Association
Again, it's interesting. We started Men's Sheds here in Winnipeg. It's now spread throughout B.C. and somewhat around Alberta, but nowhere east of Montreal. How do we start supporting it, or how do I, as an individual? I live on a fixed income. I'm 80 years old. How do I reach out to those people or get a program to those Men's Sheds or possible groups of men in other communities? It's time-consuming and it's a process. I certainly have enjoyed the challenge over the years. It gets me up in the morning.
If there was funding that would allow Men's Sheds to do their outreach outside of an individual province, that would be of assistance. If there was potential funding—and we'd have to be careful here—for a one-person advocate or manager on a national level, I think that has some merit.
We also need to try to work with Canadian mental health associations wherever we can. It's interesting that CMHA has different priorities depending on where they are. Recently I gave a Zoom meeting instruction on how to open up a Men's Shed to the rural part of the Alberta division of the Canadian Mental Health Association.
Liberal
Liberal
Han Dong Liberal Don Valley North, ON
I have a quick question to Madame Guerin.
In your work, have you noticed any challenges that seniors face in terms of accessibility? To keep them active and socially connected, accessibility is very important.
Coordinator, Conseil régional de développement social des Laurentides
Yes, it's a fairly widespread problem, especially in transportation. The Laurentides region has many rural areas, which raises major issues for public or adapted transportation. This means that seniors may be significantly isolated.
We also have a shortage of accessible and adaptable housing to accommodate the various stages that seniors go through over the years. Someone can enter housing with their independence, but then gradually lose it. The lack of adequate services or the fact that people's surroundings encourage them to move cause difficulties for those who want to remain in their homes. Social disruptions also occur when seniors have to move once they have lost their autonomy. So all levels of government should reflect on all the work that needs to be done to make housing more accessible.
Liberal
Bloc
Louise Chabot Bloc Thérèse-De Blainville, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I thank our guests very much for their testimony.
Mrs. Guerin, I salute you. Thank you for your testimony and for everything you do as coordinator of the Conseil régional de développement social des Laurentides. We can see how important these agencies are in Quebec. I congratulate you.
Your testimony is so broad. You addressed social factors, economic factors, work factors, but, above all, you succeeded in brilliantly describing the contribution that seniors make in our society. I don't know how I'm going to approach my questions. As the labour critic, I was struck by one topic in particular in your testimony: when you were talking about job losses among seniors and their return to work.
Your brief indicates that, in 2008, people aged 62 and older were the least likely to find new jobs after becoming unemployed and that they may experience negative age stereotypes in attempting to return to work.
Do you believe this problem will continue? We know that people 60 and older sometimes work to meet certain needs. Can specific efforts be made to avoid that kind of discrimination?
Coordinator, Conseil régional de développement social des Laurentides
That question could be answered from several perspectives.
Yes, seniors don't always return to the workforce by choice. Sometimes, they do so out of necessity, because they can't support themselves on their retirement pensions. This is already a problem.
On the other hand, I believe seniors will continue to be stigmatized in the labour market. If anything, the pandemic has made it worse. Because seniors are considered to be more vulnerable, employers have been hesitant to hire experienced workers, even though we have programs with financial incentives to do so. The incentives have not been enough to convince employers, who feel that hiring experienced people costs more and is more risky.
For all these reasons, I don't believe this problem is going to go away in the next few months, or even years. I think it's something that needs to be seriously addressed, because, with life expectancy on the rise, there will be more older workers. So it's an issue that we are really going to have to deal with.
Bloc
Louise Chabot Bloc Thérèse-De Blainville, QC
As you may know, the Bloc Québécois is particularly concerned about the financial situation of seniors. I'm not saying that it's the only party concerned. I don't want to stigmatize anyone. That said, we know that seniors are becoming poorer. The pandemic has increased costs in terms of groceries, housing and drugs. Some seniors are family caregivers. The cost of getting around has increased as well.
The government decided to help seniors by increasing the old age security pension, but only for people aged 75 and over. In our opinion, it would be fairer to support all seniors by providing this increase to everyone aged 65 and over. What do you think about this?
