Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Nov. 28th, 2006

[Most Rev. Brendan M. O'Brien]

What term did you use?

[Ed Komarnicki, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

In respect to sanctuary protection cases, there's no doubt that if you were to look at another avenue of appeal, such as, let's say, the Refugee Appeal Division—and we have a number of them, on humanitarian and compassionate grounds, pre-removal risk assessment, and various avenues that take sometimes years to put together, but notwithstanding all of that—church sanctuary cases would still exist, wouldn't you agree with me, if only for those very exceptional cases where you struggled and felt that the decision was not made in accordance with how you might have seen it or with the justice of the case?

So we're not going to eliminate church sanctuary cases by another avenue. We can add as many as we need, but there'll still be that need, in your view, I am sure, for sanctuary protection.

[Most Rev. Brendan M. O'Brien]

If I could just respond a bit, in 2004, around the time of this case in Quebec City, the then Minister of Immigration, Judy Sgro, made some remarks about sanctuary and she invited the heads of all the churches to come and meet with her. At that time I was the president of the Canadian Conference of Bishops, so I did have an opportunity to meet with her and with people from the different churches that are working in this area.

Certainly the impression I got was that all of the churches would rather get out of this sanctuary business, if you want to call it that. In other words, we're not really in favour of this at all. But because we feel that there are these situations where there is no second look at the merits of the case.... There are procedural methods; you could have the case looked at in terms of its legality and what not. But to really take a look at it, there was the feeling that it is really not fair for one person to be able to make that kind of determination.

But as I say, I think if this process were in place now, the churches probably would still be complaining that some terrible thing has happened to somebody, and I'm sure that would be the case, but I think we'd have less reason for doing that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

I'm sorry, Mr. Komarnicki, I have to cut it off right there. We always have a time problem at our committee. If we didn't have another committee coming in right now we could go over time a little bit more, but unfortunately some of the other committee members are coming in.

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Well, they're early, Mr. Chair. It isn't eleven o'clock yet.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

We have two minutes.

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I'd like to ask my question.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Okay, maybe I'll allow a fast question here.

Madam Folco, go ahead.

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Since I will not have time for questions, I will make a brief comment.

I would like to congratulate you, and thank you as well. I worked with the late father Julien Harvey, whom you no doubt knew very well, and who for many years focused on the issue of refugees and immigrants generally, at the Montreal Centre for Faith and Justice. I know that Christian churches, and your church in particular, have been looking very carefully about what the government can do. Even though I am very much a lay person and firmly believe in the separation of church and state, I do believe in it a little less sometimes. I would have liked you to have a little more influence over the state.

I know I will not have time to ask a question, but I would like to say I have very much appreciated your reminding us that immigration has always existed, but foreigners have always been turned away, and always been poorly welcomed by the societies forced to receive them. You have brought a broader and deeper perspective to the issue of immigration, and to the integration of immigrants.

I should add that it would be very useful for us — I mean the committee and society in general — if churches spoke up more and if we knew more about the work they do. I'm not just talking about sanctuary — the concept in which I firmly believe, even though I'm not a Christian — but also about what you do to help sponsor families, for example. Your work has to be more widely known so that others in society can follow your example.

Thank you. I am just waiting for the chair to tell me I'm out of time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Thank you, and again, I wish we had more time to allow all members to get into this discussion.

Thank you very much for your presentation today. We really appreciate it. And thank you for your very clear language, as well. We appreciate that. Please be assured that your recommendations will be made to the citizenship and immigration department.

Now we go to new business.

Mr. Siksay.

[Bill Siksay, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I just want to ask two things. One is a request and one is a reminder. The request is I'm wondering if we could have a meeting of our agenda and planning committee to look at our remaining time and the issues that we haven't covered. I think there were some suggestions for other witnesses as well, and I wonder if we could take a look at that. Maybe we could do that next week some time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

We could do that probably on Monday. Leave it with me; I'm going to try to schedule that.

And what is the reminder?

[Bill Siksay, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

I just want to remind members of the committee of the event tonight at six o'clock in Room 300 at Confederation. Members of the support group for Mohamed Harkat and some of the other security certificate detainees and possibly Mr. Harkat himself will be there. We'll also have the film by Alexandre Trudeau on the security certificate process as well.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Members are reminded.

The meeting is adjourned.