Citizenship and Immigration Committee on June 7th, 2007

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Perhaps we can bring our meeting to order.

Before I go into our committee meeting, I want to say thank you to my colleague here, Andrew Telegdi, for chairing our last committee meeting. I couldn't get here. I had glowing reports, and people actually saying that the current chair should be replaced with the vice-chair, so I had better not miss too many more committee meetings.

Thank you, Andrew, for a job well done. I appreciate it very much.

This morning I want to welcome, on behalf of the committee, our witnesses. We have Mr. Ken Sandhu, full-time member of the Immigration and Refugee Board, head office, and deputy chair of the refugee protection division in Toronto's regional office.

Welcome, Mr. Sandhu.

And we have Lois Figg, full-time member and assistant deputy chair of the Immigration and Refugee Board, Toronto regional office.

Welcome to you as well.

[Andrew Telegdi, Liberal, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

Mr. Chairman, before we go on, I just want to make sure that the appointments are under the new system.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Yes. Would you like to clarify?

Before you do that, I also want to welcome Krista Daley, senior general counsel.

Welcome to all of you here today. We'll get under way in a moment, I'm sure, when we find out what Mr. Telegdi is talking about, because I'm not totally familiar--

[Andrew Telegdi, Liberal, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

Right now the new appointments that are being processed are under the new system.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

The new appointment system.

[Andrew Telegdi, Liberal, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

Yes, the new appointment system. That's why I wanted to clarify.

[Ed Komarnicki, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

What does it matter? The witnesses are here I think because of Mr. Karygiannis' motion or request, and specifically for these two, so you can ask them any questions you want to. But how these or future appointments are made is not something that needs to be settled here at this point.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Order, please.

Maybe we can continue and get into our meeting. That will clarify itself, I'm sure, in due course.

Welcome to all of you. We look forward to a good, productive meeting, the way we generally handle it. I'm sure you're fully aware of it. You're given the opportunity to make some opening statements--and feel free to do that--after which, of course, our committee members like to take the opportunity to direct some questions your way, or to make some comments, or what have you. So please feel perfectly at home here, if that's possible, and make your statements, and we'll see what we can do to get the meeting moving along.

Mr. Sandhu, Ms. Figg, or Krista Daley, whoever wishes to make the first statement, it's in your hands.

[Ken Sandhu, Full-time member of the Immigration and Refugee Board, Deputy Chairperson of the Refugee Protection Division, As an Individual]

Okay, sir, I'll begin.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Thank you.

[Ken Sandhu]

I came to Canada in 1968 at the age of 18 as a landed immigrant. I attended high school in Guelph, Ontario, where I completed my grade 13. I completed my bachelor's degree from the University of Guelph and I worked as a correctional officer with the Ontario Ministry of Correctional Services. I was promoted to various positions, gaining experience in human and financial resources management, including experience in supervisory positions.

In March 1988 I was appointed executive vice-chair of the Ontario Board of Parole, which was an order in council appointment. In March 1995 I was appointed chair of the Ontario Board of Parole, a position I held until September 2001. Until my appointment to the Immigration and Refugee Board as a member in June of 2004, I held various executive positions with the Government of Ontario.

I have been a full-time member of the Immigration and Refugee Board for the past three years. I applied for the deputy chairperson position in the fall of 2006 in response to an advertisement that was put forward by the minister's office and I was interviewed and appointed in March 2007.

I have been completing some of the unfinished business in Toronto with respect to the hearings, and at the same time I have been attending to my responsibilities as a deputy chairperson. Essentially I have been shuttling between Toronto and Ottawa. My position is in Ottawa, and I will be moving to Ottawa in the near future.

With respect to my educational background, I completed my master's degree from York University and went on to work on my PhD, but I did not complete it. Only the thesis was left to be completed.

I have belonged to several professional voluntary organizations and have received a few awards in my life. I have a level 1 coaching certificate from the Ontario Baseball Association, and I coached minor league baseball teams for several years and girls' soccer teams.

I'm married, I have three children, and today is my 32nd wedding anniversary.

[Some hon. members]

Hear, hear!

[Ken Sandhu]

Thank you.

This, Mr. Chairman, is a part of my statement with respect to myself. I have submitted my CV, which I presume the members have. If they have any questions about any of it, I'd be happy to answer.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Thank you, Mr. Sandhu. Congratulations on this very important day. I'm sure you're looking forward to getting out of here and going to celebrate with your wife.

Ms. Figg, do you have any comments?

[Lois D. Figg, Full-time member and Assistant Deputy Chairperson of the Immigration and Refugee Board, Toronto Regional Office, As an Individual]

I have an opening statement as well.

Good morning, Mr. Chair and committee members.

I immigrated to Canada as an infant, with my parents, from England to Montreal. I grew up in Montreal. I attended CÉGEP. I attended the University of Western Ontario and graduated from it with an honours bachelor degree in history. I attended the University of Windsor Law School, at which time I developed a lifelong passion for human rights law, and was called to the Ontario bar in 1988.

Shortly thereafter I began to work for the Immigration and Refugee Board as a refugee hearings officer. Within about seven months I was promoted to manage the unit of about 40 refugee hearing officers.

In July 1990 I was hired by the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees, and I was posted to Hong Kong. I was in Hong Kong as an appeals counsellor, representing Vietnamese boat people who were detained in camps. It was my job to go to the camps and interview them and represent meritorious claims.

During the time that I was at the UNHCR, I was also seconded for about 18 months to work on a special committee dealing with, mainly, unaccompanied minors. It was my job to make a recommendation on their refugee status but also devise a durable solution for each of those minors.

In May 1994 I was appointed by the Hong Kong government to the refugee status review board, which was an appellant-level refugee decision-making authority. Later that year I returned home to Canada.

Following the birth of my daughter in—actually, her birthday was yesterday—June 1995, I became a stay-at-home mom for three years. I was a group volunteer at Metro Mothers Network in Toronto. I returned to the workforce in 1998, as I was hired by the Ontario Human Rights Commission. I was investigator there for about a year. Following that, I won a competition to become a mediator.

During that period of my life I was also a director at my daughter's day care centre. I also took an advanced law degree at night and was conferred a master's of law in June 2003 from Osgoode Hall Law School.

In early 2000 I was invited to write a three- to four-hour written test to become an IRB board member. After passing the test and being interviewed, I was appointed to the IRB in June 2000.

I trained for about four weeks and then was assigned to the Americas team in Toronto. The team I'm designated to hears claims emanating from the Americas. I was also assigned a mentor.

I should point out that I was initially appointed for two years, but in April 2002 I was reappointed for five more years. I was designated by the then chairperson, Peter Showler, to be a member manager. I led a team of decision-makers in Toronto until April 2005.

In April 2005 I was appointed as an assistant deputy chairperson of the immigration appeal division in Toronto. In the fall of that same year, Mr. Fleury, our former chair, asked me to act as deputy chairperson of the immigration appeal division for three months.

More recently, in November 2006, I competed for the position of assistant deputy chairperson in the refugee protection division, and in April 2007 Minister Finley reappointed me for three years and designated me as assistant deputy chairperson of the refugee protection division in Toronto.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Wow. Thank you. Very impressive qualifications.

Our committee members now, I'm sure, are going to make some comments. We have about an hour and ten minutes. We do have three motions that we have to deal with, so we'll break at roughly twenty minutes to one to deal with the various motions. Will that be fine?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

Or it might be even sooner.

[The Chair, Conservative, Norman Doyle]

Or it might even be sooner.

Anyway, first of all, the official critic for immigration, Mr. Omar Alghabra, I'll go to you.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Good morning, everybody. Thank you for coming here today.

I can't help but feel guilty. Both of you seem to have important occasions today and yesterday, but you're here, so I hope that didn't cause any changes of plans. I want to thank you for coming here today and congratulate you on your service and your résumés.

One of the reasons why I think we're interested in talking to you is to learn from you what your perspectives are and how you think you can, within your new roles, offer a vision, and how you can deal with the challenges and opportunities the IRB is facing. So I'm interested, and I'll be asking both of you, Mr. Sandhu first, what do you think are the most pressing challenges and opportunities right now at the IRB?

[Ken Sandhu]

Sir, I have to say that the pressing issues are that we do not wish to see the backlog grow again. We wish to make decisions as efficiently and effectively as we can. Essentially, that's the objective. If I was to mention the top concern, that would be it.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

Ms. Figg.

[Lois D. Figg]

As I'm sure you know, we have a dual mandate. We have a mandate to be fair. Quality decision-making is our primary goal, but also to be efficient. So the management team always has to take decisions grounded from that mandate.

It's our job to inform our chairperson of what directions we can take to be more efficient and fair. In this regard we have constant quality issue sessions with our members. We make sure that our members not only deliver high-quality justice and consistent decision-making, but we also want to make sure that we can be as efficient as possible at the same time.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

Thank you both.

Mr. Sandhu, building on what you just said, how do you think we, or more specifically you, can help deal with the backlog issue right now? If I were to ask you for three measures that you were going to take or adopt, as you've already accepted and I guess you've started this assignment, what would they be?

[Ken Sandhu]

Sir, we have already started to take some action. We have undertaken an initiative in our western region, which we call an integrated approach to dealing with hearings. What this means is that we have cross-appointed members from our immigration appeal division as well as our refugee protection division to hear cases in both the divisions.

We are able to do that especially in our western region, which is our smallest region, because first of all the numbers are small, and, secondly, we have to do hearings in several locations, such as Calgary. The office is in Vancouver, but we do hearings in Calgary, in Edmonton, and all the way to Winnipeg. So that would help us in using our existing resources more effectively. If a member from either division is going over to one of those sites to do an immigration appeal division, and there happens to be a pending refugee protection division claim, the member can take care of that matter.

Secondly, in our Montreal office we have looked at a simplified approach to information gathering, which will assist us in bringing forward the claims more rapidly. What we discovered was that our partner agencies, CIC and CBSA, were completing forms and information on the same candidate, and then the IRB was the third to come along and basically gather the same data. So we are looking at a simplified approach to getting information so that the cases move forward more quickly.

The last thing I would say with respect to efficiency is that we expect as appointments are being made to the board that we will have an issue with training members. We're looking at assigning resources to train members so that they can start to become decision-makers as quickly as possible.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

Do I have time, Mr. Chair?