Citizenship and Immigration Committee on April 10th, 2008

[Hélène Varvaressos]

Of course. Every year, we give employers training and information about the practices they have to adopt and about employment contracts. This is extremely well documented and monitored by Service Canada, by the consulates, and by FERME. There is a lot of oversight and the Temporary Foreign Workers Program is monitored very closely.

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

And the disciplinary action that results?

[Hélène Varvaressos]

Yes. By disciplinary action, do you mean excluding someone from the program, for example? I have never seen that. We don't handle those things. Service Canada, the agency that takes the applications, probably steps in, in those cases. Service Canada and the consulate. The consulates are the ones that agree to the conditions of employment and how things will be done on the farms.

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

I am going to put some information into the record.

Mr. Harvey asked a question about the various premiums that foreign workers have to pay, for example employment insurance. However, we have to remember that they do not receive employment insurance premiums because when the point at which they are unemployed comes, they go back to their countries.

So given that they are never eligible for employment insurance, I would recommend that they not have to pay premiums. I think this is important.

[Hélène Varvaressos]

We agree on that point. That is not a problem with the employer, it's a problem with the Canadian policy.

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Of course. We are going to be making recommendations, and I will take the opportunity to make mine.

Ms. Varvaressos, you read your recommendations out very quickly. I note that they are not in the leaflet you gave us. Could we get them in writing?

[Hélène Varvaressos]

We have prepared a brief. So I assume you will have it in the next few days.

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Thank you very much.

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Thierry St-Cyr]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Carrier, you have three minutes.

[Robert Carrier, Bloc, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Lemieux, we were talking earlier about the possibility of agricultural workers unionizing. You seemed to tell us that there was no problem with that. A few days ago, we were told about a worker in Quebec who had made efforts to unionize. In theory, his ability to work toward that was recognized. The employer came back to work in Quebec year after year. But that year the Department of Citizenship and Immigration denied him a work permit. He said that his usual employer was prepared to hire him back and there didn't seem to be a problem.

Can you give us any details about that case? I've forgotten the name.

[Pierre Lemieux]

This is the first time I've heard about that.

The UPA does not take a position on unionizing. We think it is the general rule of the unionizing process that applies to workers and employees. The AGRIcarrières executive goes so far as to say that unionizing has good and bad sides. It is part of the social game.

[Robert Carrier, Bloc, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Does Ms. Varvaressos have more information about this?

[Hélène Varvaressos]

You have raised the case of a worker who says he didn't get his work permit. You say that the employer was expecting him. I can't answer that. You should perhaps approach the government authorities.

[Robert Carrier, Bloc, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

That person had made efforts among the workers to unionize them. This case must be fairly well known. I didn't take notes, but in any event...

[Hélène Varvaressos]

Out of 5,000 workers... If you tell me as well that the employer wanted him to come, I don't know what happened.

[Robert Carrier, Bloc, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

So you are not aware of that case?

[Hélène Varvaressos]

No.

[Robert Carrier, Bloc, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Are there unions among the people who work for your agricultural producers? Does this exist at any particular employer or group of employers?

[Hélène Varvaressos]

We did an analysis of the situation in terms of associations or unionizing in agriculture, at AGRIcarrières, to determine exactly what the situation was. At the ministère du Travail, we identified 22 collective agreements relating to poultry farms, hog farms and greenhouses. Those collective agreements do exist. We hear a lot more about workers unionizing in greenhouse businesses. Foreign temporary workers have recently applied for certification in a greenhouse—I think it's Hydroserres Mirabel—and the temporary workers in that business succeeded in unionizing.

[The Vice-Chair, Bloc, Thierry St-Cyr]

Thank you very much. Unfortunately, I have to speak to Mr. Harvey. Perhaps he will leave you a little time to finish.

[Luc Harvey, Conservative, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Go ahead, you have 30 seconds.

[Hélène Varvaressos]

I just want to say that on most farms, seasonal agricultural workers are prevented from unionizing under a Quebec regulation that says there have to be three employees working year-round before they can unionize. This year, there are three farms where Mexican workers tried to unionize, but they were prevented. At present, there is a proceeding to challenge that regulation. There may be unionized businesses, but most of the seasonal workers can't do that.

[Luc Harvey, Conservative, Louis-Hébert, QC]

You have answered the question I wanted to ask. The problem with unionizing is more associated with the fact that it is seasonal work, is that right? On the other farms, are seasonal workers able to unionize? I don't know enough about unions to say whether they can do that, based on the periods covered. I don't think it is a problem associated with immigrant workers or anything. I think it's a problem associated with seasonal work.

[Hélène Varvaressos]

The only three applications for union certification we know about are applications by foreign temporary workers to be certified. The other collective agreements that exist were signed by local unions, for the most part. There are some that are affiliated with the FTQ, but they have never needed to go to court to exercise those rights. It's been settled within the business.

[Luc Harvey, Conservative, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Have you heard anything about that, about seasonal workers wanting to unionize?