Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Feb. 3rd, 2009

[The Clerk]

As I understand it, it is that the order of questions for the first round of questioning be as follows: Liberal, Bloc, NDP, CPC. Questioning during the second round shall alternate between the opposition members and government members in the following fashion: Liberal, Bloc, Conservative, Conservative, Liberal, Conservative, Conservative, based on the principle that each committee member should have a full opportunity to question the witnesses. If time permits, further rounds shall repeat the pattern of the first round, at the discretion of the chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

You have to be clear, because you're going to prepare a chart. Are you okay, Mr. Clerk?

[The Clerk]

I believe so.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

There is an amendment. Is there any further debate on either of these things?

I call the question on the amendment.

(Amendment agreed to)

(Motion as amended agreed to)

Further motions?

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Mr. Chair, I would then put the previous motion back on the table: that the witnesses from any one organization shall be allowed 10 minutes to make their opening statement. During the questioning of witnesses, there shall be allocated seven minutes for the first round of questioning and thereafter five minutes shall be allocated to each questioner in the second and subsequent rounds of questioning.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. Karygiannis.

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

I have just a point of clarification. Sometimes it could be that we have a lot of witnesses stacked up, and if we have, let's say, three or four organizations here and we only have two hours to hear them, maybe we'd want to consider that. Instead of ten minutes an organization, the chair might be allowed to shift that around. If we had four organizations, that's forty minutes, and if you go those rounds and we have only two hours to hear them, we could be way out of whack.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

The chair has a comment. What happens if there is one witness? I don't know how often that would happen.

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

It does happen, but then that witness is given 10 minutes and then we get the rounds.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Excuse me, Mr. Karygiannis, my observation is that you could conceivably have one witness for one hour. So you're still saying 10 minutes, as opposed to 20 minutes, for example.

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Definitely, and if we have four or five organizations, as sometimes is the case, we only have two hours. So instead of giving each organization ten minutes, that would take you to an hour--

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

You are suggesting the chair has some discretion.

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

With consultation with the two vice-chairs.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Of course.

Are you okay?

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

If we get more than one....

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Yes, if that's understood. I understood that would be the case at all committees, that if we had a number of witnesses coming forward we would leave some discretion with the chair to be able to allocate less time for speaking.

If you want, we could actually amend and add one word: that the witnesses from any one organization shall be allowed a maximum of 10 minutes. That allows the chair some discretion.

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

That is a maximum of 10 minutes, at the discretion of the chair.

[Maurizio Bevilacqua, Liberal, Vaughan, ON]

Mr. Chair, so that we are very clear, these are guidelines, and some are rules, but with workings of the committee, of course we have to be a little bit flexible, so that if there is a person who is engaged in some very interesting questioning of a witness, flexibility can be allowed so that we have a dynamic process rather than something that is strictly adhered to. You have to have flexibility in these types of committees. We work with the chair at all times.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

I'm glad to hear that.

Then you have changed your--

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Yes, I made just that--

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Are there any further amendments?

I call the question--

Ms. Chow, sorry.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

Previously we had it that whenever a minister or any officials appeared before the committee, if they are to speak from notes, a copy of the statement or notes be distributed by the start of their statement.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

That's coming up.

All those in favour of this motion?

(Motion agreed to)

Mr. Dykstra.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Following up on Ms. Chow, it sounds as if she supported the motion that whenever a minister or any officials appear before the committee where they are able to speak from notes, a copy of the statement or notes be distributed by the start of their statements, to be fair to each member of the committee.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

I have a point of order. In the notes given to us, it was attached as the same questioning of witnesses. It's the same thing.