Citizenship and Immigration Committee on March 10th, 2009

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. We'll call the meeting to order.

This is the sixth meeting of the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration, Tuesday, March 10, 2009. The orders of the day are the main estimates 2009-10, votes 1, 5, and 10 under Citizenship and Immigration, and supplementary estimates (C), 2008-09, votes 1c and 5c under Citizenship and Immigration.

We have as our guests this morning the Honourable Jason Kenney, Minister of Citizenship, Immigration and Multiculturalism. He is accompanied by members from the ministry: Mr. Richard Fadden, who is the deputy minister, and Mr. Wayne Ganim, who is the chief financial officer for the finance branch.

Good morning to the three of you.

Minister, you've done this a few times before. You'll have some introductory comments, followed by questions from the members.

Thank you, sir, for coming.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Minister of Citizenship]

Thank you Mr. Chairman and Members of the Committee.

Mr. Chairman and dear colleagues, I have the honour today to place before the Committee my department's Supplementary estimates (C) for fiscal year 2008-09, and its Main estimates for fiscal year 2009-10, for which I seek the Committee's approval.

Mr. Chairman, the Supplementary estimates (C) include new funding requests of $18 million to increase departmental spending authorities to $1.39 billion for the current 2008-09 fiscal year.

The 2009-10 Main estimates represent a net increase of 38.8 million over the previous fiscal year's Main estimates funding levels, bringing total planned spending of the department for next year to almost $1.36 billion, just shy of the total authorities for the current year.

Since our government came to office, the overall CIC budget has increased from $882.5 million to $1.392 billion, representing an increase of 56%. I anticipate further increases in the coming year.

Managing the system by which we address the ways for newcomers to come to Canada and integrate here demands our daily attention. But I believe this attention is paying off. Last month I told you that our backlog of skilled worker applications had exploded from under 50,000 cases in 1993 to approximately 600,000 cases in 2008. Our action plan is designed to speed up processing of applications and make our immigration system more closely aligned and responsive to our economy, our labour market needs. New federal skilled worker applicants, including those with arranged employment, should receive a decision on their application within 6 to 12 months.

As I explained to the committee during my last appearance, the backlog of skilled worker applications had gone from approximately 600,000 to 515,000 by the end of 2008--a significant drop of 15%. I think this is the first time we've seen a drop rather than an increase in nearly two decades. Last year was the first year the backlog was reduced, as I say. I'm confident we will continue to reduce the backlog, and as I get new numbers I will update the public, and this committee, to show how the action plan for faster immigration is delivering real results.

While we're making important improvements on managing immigration, Mr. Chairman, some elements continue to challenge us. In January, as you know, I visited some of our country's busiest visa offices, in Pakistan and India. During a visit to our offices in Chandigarh, for example, I was shown its wall of shame, a collection of the phony documents that had been discovered in submissions from immigration applications.

Immigration fraud can take many forms, from inauthentic documents to marriages of convenience. While I was in India I heard about the growth of so-called marriage palaces, where actors are hired to play the part of guests at fake weddings. This is done to create fraudulent marriage photos to try to fool our visa officers. Some fraud is perpetrated by applicants, and some is perpetrated by unscrupulous immigration representatives who are unregistered and unlicensed. It happens around the world, and Canada is far from being the only country challenged by it. I met with immigration program heads from a number of different countries in New Delhi who are facing similar challenges.

From those who seek to come to Canada to those living here, people need to know three key things about fraud. First of all, it's a criminal offence in Canada. Secondly, it damages our immigration system and it can affect people who seek to come here on lawful and legitimate grounds. Thirdly, it costs all of us money. In short, they need to understand that protecting against fraud is not just the concern of those in government and the legal system, but it's everyone's concern. One way to do this is to stop fraud, before it starts, by informing people both inside and outside of Canada of its consequences.

Mr. Chairman, we are raising awareness of the potential for fraud by third parties through a key tool, which I'm happy to present to you and members of the committee today, namely a video that warns against the dangers of unscrupulous representatives and includes tips on how to choose an accredited representative. In the coming weeks this video, as well as a brochure with similar information, will be distributed to our overseas missions and regional offices in Canada and Service Canada centres. We will also send the video to ethnic and mainstream media outlets in Canada for use as a public service announcement.

At the same time, CIC's website already contains a warning in English, French, and 15 other languages about third party fraud. I saw similar signs displayed at our missions in India as well. It also provides tips for applicants on choosing competent and professional representatives. I believe this demonstrates the commitment of the department and the government to alerting potential immigrants and their families in this country from those who might use fraud in attempts to undermine our immigration system. I've asked the department to continue to explore other ways in which we can inform our clients about this very important issue.

We also need to do more in the area of enforcement. I should note that while in India I also met with the Chief Minister of Punjab, Parkash Singh Badal, who committed to step up efforts to combat fraudulent immigration representatives who operate out of Chandigarh and Punjab. Within a week of my departure he had already contacted our Chandigarh office to discuss ways we can work together, and there were news reports in Indian newspapers about a crackdown on shady immigration consultancies.

I also plan to consult with stakeholders and recent immigrants on their experiences and suggestions for ways to improve the system. This is a priority for me in the months ahead.

I look forward to working further with the committee on this important issue, and I would really appreciate the multi-partisan advice of this committee. This is an issue that, I'm sure, concerns us all.

We have a duty to educate potential immigrants on how to minimize risks when hiring representatives. We are working to make sure that current and potential newcomers understand three important facts about their efforts to emigrate here. First, it's entirely optional for them to hire third party representatives. Second, Canada treats all applicants equally, whether or not applicants use the service of representatives. And third, there are risks in hiring an immigration representative, but if applicants do so, they should seek out members of the organizations I mentioned earlier.

Mr. Chairman, across the country we see settlement funding. I want briefly to address settlement funding as key to helping newcomers succeed.

Since 2006, our government has substantially increased funding, to the tune of an additional $1.4 billion over five years in all provinces and territories outside Quebec, to support settlement programs and services. That essentially brings all the provinces up to roughly the per capita funding that Quebec has received.

In the first Speech from the Throne following the election, our government promised to work with the provinces to increase uptake in settlement services. That's because, in spite of the significant amount of money we are investing in settlement funding, only about 20% of newcomers to Canada use the LINC language training programs.

One of the most important ways to facilitate the integration and success of newcomers is through settlement programs such as language training. Perhaps we should look at new ways to encourage the use of settlement programs such as language training. For example, would newcomers feel more empowered and more likely to access these services if we gave them a certificate, for instance, for the appropriate amount of language training, which they could then use to shop around to find the best service provider for their particular needs? Such an approach to empower immigrants would also increase their knowledge of the programs available to them. I believe this would encourage newcomers to make greater use of the service, and this would make settlement organizations more responsive to the needs of newcomers.

I encourage this committee to address settlement program uptake within the broader issue of integration. In fact, Mr. Chairman, I would encourage the committee to study the wider question of settlement funding and undertake a thorough study in this regard.

Mr. Chairman, for professionals aiming to immigrate to Canada, recognition of their credentials can be the key to opening the door to their future. And in the current global recession that we face, attracting these skilled and dedicated newcomers to Canada can be the key to opening a door to our country's future.

But while we have successfully attracted immigrants, recognizing their foreign credentials continues to pose a problem across this country. As you all know, the provinces and territories are responsible for assessing and recognizing credentials. This is why, in 2007, we created the Foreign Credentials Referral Office. This is also why, in Canada's economic action plan, this government committed $50 million over two years to support the development of the common approach to foreign credential assessment, something which will help to ensure that newcomers better integrate into the labour market.

And it is why just last month, Prime Minister Harper addressed foreign credentials with provincial and territorial first ministers, reaching an agreement to develop, by next September, a pan-Canadian framework to evaluate and recognize foreign qualifications. It is our intention that this framework, once in place, will result in standardized and faster recognition of newcomers' foreign credentials.

Mr. Chairman, there is a momentum building among foreign credential recognition stakeholders towards action with the support of all levels of government. I personally feel this is crucial to build the future of Canada. When I meet newcomers — and I meet many — foreign credential recognition is the number one issue on their minds.

Before ending, I would like to stress that I am in constant contact with my counterparts in the provinces and territories, members of cultural communities, as well as my international counterparts. This Committee also serves as a valuable sounding board, so I am grateful for your interest and input.

Thank you for this opportunity, Mr. Chairman. My officials and I would now be happy to respond to your question.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Thank you, Minister, for your comments. As you know, we have seven-minute rounds, followed by five-minute rounds, and the first person is Mr. Bevilacqua.

[Maurizio Bevilacqua, Liberal, Vaughan, ON]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

Minister, thank you, and also to your officials.

I listened very carefully to what you had to say, but there's always this impression you give, and your government gives, that in fact you're very open to immigration. I've yet to receive from you or your department the rationale as to why, over the past three years you've been in government, the Conservative government has shut its door on more than 50,000 landed immigrants. That is a concern I have, and it's very inconsistent with the messaging of this government that in fact it is a government that cares, a government that is open to immigration. The landed immigrant numbers speak to a different reality.

The other issue concerns the foreign credentials accreditation. This program was announced with much fanfare, yet last time you were here I asked you to find out how many immigrants have actually received foreign credential accreditation as a result of the investment made by this government.

The other issue concerns the processing times for skilled workers. When you look at 2004 versus the actual date, you see that Pakistan went from 44 months to 70 months; China, from 47 months to 68 months; Sri Lanka, from 41 months to 71 months; India, from 50 months to 73 months; Syria, from 55 months to 71 months; Manilla, from 53 months to 65 months.

I know those are quite a few points I've raised already, but I'm not done yet.

There's also concern about the whole issue of refugees and how that particular part of the portfolio is being handled. According to your own departmental performance reports that were recently issued, the backlog of refugee claims has more than doubled since the Conservatives took office, the number of finalized claims has decreased by 50%, the average processing times have increased to an average of 14 months due to fewer experienced decision-makers, and even the average cost per claim has increased by almost $2,000 over the last three years.

Forgive me, Minister, but I think there are a lot of things going on here that require attention, and quite frankly, it's a record that concerns me as an individual who cares about immigrants and immigration here in Canada. I view immigration as a very important pillar, a foundation of nation building, so these issues create a great deal of concern to me and to the millions of Canadians who've chosen this country as their new land.

I would like you to go through this, and if you don't have enough time, perhaps you could send responses in writing to me, so I can in fact relay that message also to the many individuals who have raised these issues.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Bevilacqua, for those substantive questions and your long-standing concern about immigration.

First of all, on the general intake, I would not agree with the premise of your question. In fact, just to give you some statistical insight into this, since 2005 the number of foreign students admitted to Canada has increased from 68,000 to 79,000. That's a 17% increase in three years. Since 2005 the number of temporary foreign workers has risen by 57%. We've now created a Canadian experience class, and a number of those people will be eligible to apply for permanent residency. Permanent residents have increased from 236,000 in 2004 to 247,000 in 2008. This represents a 5% increase overall. The total entry of foreign students, temporary foreign workers, and permanent residents was 520,000 in 2008, up from 453,000 in 2005. This represents an overall increase of 15% from the last year the previous government was in office.

If you really want to compare statistics on this, between 1993 and 1997, in the previous government's first four or five years in office, the total number of permanent residents welcomed to Canada declined from roughly 250,000 to 175,000, a reduction of 75,000 cases. So we've actually increased permanent resident intake in our first three years, whereas the previous government cut it. Finally, I believe that Canada alone, amongst immigrant-receiving developed countries, is planning to maintain immigration levels rather than cut them in this difficult economic year.

As it relates to foreign credential recognition, I have the same problem answering that question as I did the last time. Over 400 regulatory bodies governed by the provinces do credential recognition, not the federal government, so we don't have a statistical basis to track how many people are accredited. Our objective, as articulated by my colleague the Minister of Human Resources, is that once we get in place this pan-Canadian framework for credential recognition with the implication of all the provinces, funded by our $50 million allotment in this year's economic action plan, we hope that all applicants for credential recognition will have a clear answer from the relevant professional bodies within a year of their applications. That's the kind of benchmark we will be setting for the provinces to set for their professional regulatory bodies.

As it relates to processing, wait times for 70% of all economic class permanent resident cases have been reduced from 57 months in 2005 to 43 months in 2007 under our government. Of all non-economic permanent residents, the wait times have fallen from 22 months in 2005 to 13 months in 2007. When it comes to all skilled workers, wait times for the majority of cases have dropped from 43 months in 2005 to 29 months in 2007. As I reiterated today, in the largest stream of our inventory--the federal skilled worker category--we've seen a 15% reduction since the introduction of our action plan for faster immigration, which is really a signal achievement, and probably the first time in a generation we've seen that inventory go down rather than up.

Finally, with respect to the refugee inventory, obviously this is an issue that concerns us.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

We're down to the end.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Let me just say that a large number of recent nominations that I've brought forward to cabinet have been accepted. We're now operating at about 90% occupancy among members of the IRB. That should help address the backlog. We need to look more broadly at inland refugee reform. For instance, last year we received over 10,000 inland refugee claimants from Mexico, who are facing a 90% rejection rate at the IRB. I think we need to ask whether that's an efficient use of our resources and whether that's creating problems for the IRB and legitimate refugees by allowing false refugee claimants to clog the system.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Thank you, Mr. Minister.

Mr. St-Cyr.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Minister, I would like to ask a few questions regarding the immigrant investor program. I have already drawn your attention, among others matters, to the situation in Quebec which has its own immigrant investor program. There are concerns regarding the processing times. Once the selection has been made by Quebec and once those immigrant investors have invested $400,000, they get an answer after a relatively stable wait time. But down the line, when their application is sent to Ottawa for processing of the health and security aspects, it seems that the wait time becomes extremely long for checks that should in most cases be rather simple, and those delays vary widely depending on which office in the world deals with the file.

I would like to know what the situation is in terms of processing times of applications sent by Quebec. How do they compare to those that are dealt with under the federal investor program?

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Thank you for your question, Mr. St-Cyr. Let me tell you that we give priority to applications under the Quebec immigrant investor program over those under the federal program. I am being told that there is no deliberate delay. Some times security agents have to investigate before issuing a security clearance. Sometimes this can add to the processing time but I can assure you that there is no deliberate delay by the federal government in dealing with these applications.

I might ask my deputy minister if he has something to add on this.

[Richard Fadden, Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would just like to note that all requests for a security check are sent to our security agencies. They are told what the department's priorities are. Without commenting in detail on the difficulties of the Border Services Agency and the security agencies, they have their own problems. There are too many files to process, they probably lack funding. So the delays you mention are not exclusive to Quebec, they are the same we have to endure all over.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

As for the provenance of the funds, at the early stages of the program in Quebec, concerns were expressed about a lack of verification of the provenance of the invested funds, to ensure they were legitimate and legal. So the government of Quebec made improvements. At the present time, immigration lawyers tell us that the federal government also undertakes very intensive checks of the provenance of the funds. So we have two governments doing the same thing.

I would like to know first of all if this is true. Who is responsible? Who is in charge of checking the provenance of the money? If it is the federal government, the government of Quebec should stop doing that, or vice versa. At the present time, there seems to be duplication. What is the set up in this regard?

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

I will defer to the deputy minister since I am not aware of the administrative details of this program.

[Richard Fadden]

Essentially, Mr. Chairman, the member is right. It is a huge problem for us, not only in Quebec but throughout Canada. The provenance of the money is very difficult to verify. You are right when you say that Quebec has the initial responsibility to verify if the provenance of the funds is legitimate. However, I must admit that, not only for applications coming from Quebec but also from all the other provinces, if concerns arise based on the facts in a specific application, we sometimes review the source of the funds. However, this is exceptional in Quebec's case. I want to be very clear. This is an exception, but the federal government is nevertheless generally responsible for ensuring that no fraud is associated with these files. We have discussed those issues with the government of Quebec and, as you said at the beginning, it also has reinforced its verification. The number of times where both governments undertake provenance checks is very limited. I do not have the figures, but I am told they are very small.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

So when some immigration lawyers tell us this happens more systematically, this is a wrong perception, according to you. Is this true of all processing offices abroad or are there offices where a second verification by the federal government, following that of Quebec, happens more frequently.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Again, this is an administrative matter. I will ask the deputy minister to answer.

[Richard Fadden]

First of all, to my knowledge, Mr. Chairman, this does not happen systematically. There might be specific files, in one place or another, that are problematic. That being said, we must recognize that lawyers or consultants are hired to deal with the more problematic cases. From their viewpoint, it might seem that specific issues exist. However, I repeat that as far as we are concerned, this is not a general problem in the system.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

Very well. I would like to have with the minister a more general discussion about this program. We know that there are issues, rather long processing times. In a period of economic downturn, would it not be a good investment by the government of Canada to provide a few million dollars in supplementary funding in order to speed up the processing of immigrant investor applications? This could translate into probably billions of dollars of investment in Canada from these applicants.

In the estimates that you table here today — which are after all the subject of this meeting — do you have funding to speed up the processing of these files, considering the economic benefit this might provide at this difficult time?

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

No, not specifically, Mr. Chairman. We have added in the last budget $109 million for case processing by the department. In the supplementary estimates that we table today, we do not increase funding for this program.

However, I have to admit that you make a sound argument. This means that we should focus on programs that help our economy. This is why I have asked the department to advise on ways to improve the administration of the immigrant investor program. I should add that Quebec has a program that attracts many more immigrant investors than the federal one. Maybe we could learn something from the Quebec program which works very efficiently.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Merci.

Ms. Chow.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

Thank you.

I have three questions that I will give to you in one shot. I actually have them written out, and if they get too long I will just pass the notes to you, and I know you'll respond in writing.

The first one really is about temporary foreign workers. Your planned target is in the tens of thousands. I have a report from the Human Resources folks documenting examples from the live-in caregiver program of employers illegally confiscating employees' passports and other legal documents. And there are reports of verbal and emotional abuse and negligence and sexual assault, which are not uncommon. Some provincial employment standards allow the employers to pay a training wage for the first 500 hours that is lower than the minimum wage. There is evidence to suggest that temporary status fosters vulnerability to abuse, and that the workers accept unacceptable working conditions for fear of unemployment or deportation. The pressure to get a good work record deters workers from reporting abuse.

On the farm workers program, workers pay into EI but are not qualified for EI. They pay into the CPP, the Canada Pension Plan, but are not aware of most of those benefits. They have long working hours without rest or overtime pay, and there is inadequate workplace safety training, inadequate access to medical care, and poor housing, poor community relations, and verbal and physical abuse.

In terms of the pilot project for low-skill occupations, again, having low-skilled domestic workers earning low wages means poor labour market outcomes for them. There is a document showing the consequences in terms of increased emergency medical care, rising crime rates, etc.

The reason I put all of this in writing is that it comes from a report from Human Resources, and it is a problem.

So I really have two questions. What is your plan to protect the most vulnerable? Second, there is the Juana Tejada law, which you are familiar with. Sadly, she passed away. It's about the second medical examination people have to go through once they qualify for landed immigrant status in Canada under the live-in caregiver program. So that's one whole area for you to focus on: temporary foreign workers.

The second one is really the same question I asked you the last time you were here. It's about the global case management system. You probably know that the Auditor General, in her November 2006 report—before you became the minister—said that they threw in all this money. It's $48 million over budget and two years late. Now, the last time you were here, you requested $31 million on top of that. And this time you're asking for another $24 money. So are we throwing good money after bad?

And when can we get a status report about what's happening to all of your IT projects?

Does the global case management system connect with the MyCIC, the application files, so that we can really track who we want to deport and what's happening to the applications? So that's a whole area, if you can address that.

This is the last one. Two weeks ago when you were here, you asked for $2 million for your advertising budget. This time you're asking for another $3 million in the supplementary estimates (C). That is $5 million, Mr. Minister, $5 million. So the supplementary estimates (B) were for $2 million, plus these supplementary estimates (C) for $3 million. What are you doing with this money?

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

You have a minute and a half. Good luck.

Everybody's been going over, ladies and gentlemen.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Thank you, Ms. Chow.

On the first question of live-in caregivers, first of all, let me express my condolences and that of the government for the loss of Juana Tejada, whom I knew. She was a compassionate and courageous woman. We regret her loss, and we respect her fight.

I can tell you, Ms. Chow, that starting this spring, I intend to review ways in which we can improve the live-in caregiver program to ensure the appropriate protection of the rights of live-in caregivers and to ensure that the program works better. I intend to begin with community consultations in that respect, consulting with, amongst others, representatives of the Filipino community who have a particularly strong interest in the issue. I'm willing to give serious consideration to the principle behind what you characterize as the Tejada law. In this respect, we need to acknowledge that it's the provincial labour codes that govern the rights of workers. It's not entirely a matter of federal jurisdiction, but I'd be happy to work with you on this issue.

With respect to the global case management system, I'm sure this is a concern of every Minister of Immigration since this program began six or seven years ago. The Treasury Board has taken a series of very close looks at the program, has narrowed its focus, and has insisted on outside audits to ensure that the program is being administered efficiently.

I am persuaded that we need something like GCMS. We're operating in the 1960s, technologically speaking, which is one of the reasons we have such slow processing times, relatively speaking. We're dealing with masses of paper. I was just at our case processing centre in Vegreville on Friday. It is unbelievable what we are doing in terms of paper processing. We should be like other countries and operate electronically. I'll turn that over to the deputy for detailed comments on the spending with respect to GCMS.

Finally, on advertising, the supplementary budget for advertising we brought forward last time was for funds that had already been spent. The $3 million constitutes a transfer to CIC from the PCO advertising budget.

I'm out of time, I guess.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

You're out of time.

Mr. Shory.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

We'll try to respond in more detail to Ms. Chow in writing.