Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Nov. 29th, 2010

[Neil Yeates]

Chair, I think the short answer, as the member suggested, is that we actually don't know, in terms of numbers, because by definition, people are underground. However, we are well aware, as is the Immigration and Refugee Board, that there is a backlog of cases at the IRB, and we're working hard with them now to try to work our way through that backlog. We'll see how that goes. But in terms of the implementation of the new system next year, we would like to have gotten rid of as much of that backlog as possible.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

But those are above ground; they're not underground.

[Neil Yeates]

Yes, they're claimants.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Thank you, Ms. Chow.

Mrs. Grewal, it's your turn.

[Nina Grewal, Conservative, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

Thank you, Chair. And thanks to the officials for their time.

Our government recognizes the challenges that Canada's refugee determination system faces, and we have brought in important legislation to ensure that it is fast and fair for everyone who comes to Canada.

Could you please update the committee on the implementation of the Balanced Refugee Reform Act?

[Neil Yeates]

Certainly, Chair. Maybe I will start, and then ADM Linklater can carry on.

As members know, the bill received royal assent in early July, so we've now been working hard with our partners at CSIS, the RCMP, the Department of Justice, and the Department of Public Safety to implement the new regime.

As you know, as members, it's a very complicated system. There's a whole series of things that we're working on: updated regulations, new rules at the Immigration and Refugee Board.... They're starting consultations on that, by the way. New staff are being hired. The IRB is moving from governor-in-council appointees, as you would know, to civil servant decision-makers. They're finalizing the job descriptions and the staffing strategies for those positions as they set up the RPD, the Refugee Protection Division. They're also setting up the Refugee Appeal Division, which is new. They will be GIC appointees, so they're working on the strategy for getting that up and running. We're working on the interoperability of all of our computer systems between the different agencies, because there are some improvements we need to make there.

In CIC, we are coordinating this effort between all of these partner departments. We're working on trying to reduce the backlog for our humanitarian and compassionate cases and for our pre-removal risk assessment cases as well.

Those are simply a few of the components that are in train for this very complex set of machinery that is the refugee determination system.

[Nina Grewal, Conservative, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

I see.

Mr. Chair, the rest of my time I'll pass to Mr. Dykstra.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Okay.

Mr. Dykstra.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I want to follow up a little bit on your commitment from 2009, in terms of offering protection to more than 22,000 refugees here, including more than 12,000 who've resettled from abroad. One of the things we did as a government, and it was supported in the House by all opposition parties, was pass Bill C-11, which committed to an additional 2,500 refugees on a yearly basis to our current obligations to the UN.

I do want to get an understanding of this because I think it needs to be clarified. Those refugees, whether they be Bhutanese or whether they be Iraqi, are in fact already approved and it's been indicated, from a UN perspective and from a worldwide perspective, that they are true refugees.

[Neil Yeates]

Yes, that's correct.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Obviously, it makes things much more difficult for us to be able to fulfill our international obligations with respect to accepting refugees here in Canada if, on an intermittent basis, we have a number, in some cases hundreds, literally, show up on the doorstep--or at the “waterstep”, if you want to use that language--and that does obviously hurt and hinder our ability to fulfill our international obligations.

[Neil Yeates]

Chair, one of the challenges has always been focusing our efforts in working with the international community, with the UN, the UNHCR, when dealing with a lot of very protracted refugee situations around the world. I mentioned Nepal and the Bhutanese refugees. Yes, that requires a lot of effort, but we feel it's a really critical part of what we do in the refugee determination program, and that is our preferred route for resettling refugees from around the world.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Chair, how much time do I have left?

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Three minutes.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Great. Thank you.

One of the things that I also want to touch base with you on is the whole issue around our “Discover Canada” guide, which was actually very successful in terms of being issued this year.

Could you speak a little bit to the success of the guide itself, and also speak to the fact that we have faced some challenges with respect to those who have applied for their citizenship, gone through the test, and now find it's not as easy to become a Canadian citizen and achieve the status that many in the world would love to have?

[Neil Yeates]

Thank you.

Chair, as members will know, we did do a very major revision of the citizenship guide called “Discover Canada”. It is I think a much more comprehensive document than the previous version, and we redeveloped the citizenship test to match the new guide. It remains a multiple-choice test, but it is more difficult than the previous test. However, if one studies the guide, we wouldn't expect people to have difficulty with it. We are monitoring it quite carefully. We've made some revisions as we go along. We track responses to individual questions, and if we find a question is not hitting the mark, then we go back and look at it, whether it's being adequately covered in the guide or not, whether the question is worded in a way perhaps that people are not understanding in the way we thought they might. We will continue to make those changes as we go along.

The guide itself has proven enormously popular. I referenced that we've sent out hundreds of thousands of copies. It's been downloaded on the web a couple of hundred thousand times. We have an audio guide as well that people can download. It has proven to be immensely popular as well.

We are encouraging its use among teachers and students. We've developed a corner of our website for teachers and students, and the citizenship material is there. As I say, we were surprised at what the public response and the take-up has been to that material.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Thank you.

One of the other areas that you've obviously done a lot of work in is for those who are trying to apply to come here for permanent residency. The whole Canadian experience class program and the uptake of that, the success of it--perhaps you could speak very briefly to that.

It has become a very popular opportunity for those who have the skill sets and have been here long enough to be able to apply. It is a process that is actually moved through much more quickly than people had anticipated it would take in terms of wait times.

[Neil Yeates]

Yes, we are very pleased with the Canadian experience class, Chair. The huge strength of the program is that it works off Canadian credentials and Canadian work experience.

As committee members will know, one of the key issues for immigrants to Canada is foreign credential recognition. It's been a challenge for many years. I think we are making some significant progress now with the national framework. However, the CEC program essentially bypasses that problem because it's basically picking up people who are already at Canadian colleges and universities, so we know, obviously, the credential is not going to be a problem in the Canadian marketplace. That's coupled with Canadian work experience at defined levels. These people who are well educated are in the workplace now and are already successful.

One of the other key issues is language—

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

No, no, that's it.

Language.

[Neil Yeates]

Language.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

That's it.

[Neil Yeates]

C'est tout. Merci.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

We're going to move on to Mr. Trudeau.

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

Thank you, Chair.

I'm going to pick up on some of my concerns around the cap, which I alluded to in an earlier question. But first I'd like to get a little clarification on something Mr. Dykstra referred to.

He referred to the UN convention refugees as “true refugees”—the fact that they have been identified and analyzed by the UN. In many cases, as you explained, it has been in protracted situations in horrible circumstances in large refugee camps around the world.

Could you tell me, by Canadian law, for a refugee who is a convention refugee or a refugee who shows up at an airport and declares they are seeking asylum...? Once they've been determined by our Canadian processes to be refugees, is there a difference between a convention refugee and a refugee arriving by boat, by air, by plane?

[Neil Yeates]

Chair, essentially they end up in the same place, whether determined by the IRB here in Canada or by the UN and brought in as a government-assisted or a privately sponsored refugee.