Citizenship and Immigration Committee on June 11th, 2013

[Sadia Groguhé, NDP, Saint-Lambert, QC]

Madam Chair, the broadening of the scope of this bill has been a grave concern to us, because it would radically alter the original bill. As we have mentioned, the initial bill should have been reviewed and revised. And because it imposed certain limits in its wording, we worked on the issues together as a committee for several sittings to finally propose some amendments.

In the meantime, the Minister of Citizenship, Immigration and Multiculturalism decided to broaden the scope of the bill, as I have just stated, and he proposed his own amendments. However, the minister's proposed broadening distorts the very nature of the initial bill. Now, we cannot even refer to this bill as a private member's bill because it is actually a government bill as moved by the Minister of Citizenship, Immigration and Multiculturalism.

That said, let us get back to the question of privilege I raised in the House. I will start by reiterating the content of the question and then read the speaker's reply. My question was the following:

Mr. Speaker I rise today on the question of privilege — which is not truly a question of privilege — raised by my colleague from Toronto Centre. The question has to do with the eighth report of the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration, which recommends to the House that it:

[...] be granted the power during its consideration of Bill C-425...

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Madam Chair, I have a point of order.

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

We have a point of order.

Madame Groguhé, if I could beg your indulgence one more time, I know you've had many interruptions, and as a chair I do feel terrible, but we do have a point of order from Ms. Sitsabaiesan.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Madam Chair, I'm just wondering if you can advise the committee if we have quorum right now.

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

Yes, we have quorum.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Thank you.

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

Madame Groguhé.

[Sadia Groguhé, NDP, Saint-Lambert, QC]

I was mentioning the question of privilege I had raised before the Speaker of the House, to see about the relevance of tabling the eighth report of the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration.

So I will resume my reading of this question of privilege raised in the House:

[...] be granted the power during its consideration of Bill C-425, An Act to amend the Citizenship Act (honouring the Canadian Armed Forces) to expand the scope of the bill such that the provisions of the bill be not limited to the Canadian Armed Forces.

I want to share why I think this question should be ruled out of order. However, before I share my arguments, I would like to correct what has been said so far. When the Honourable Leader of the Government in the House of Commons, the member for York—Simcoe, spoke on April 25th, 2013, he misled the House. In speaking about the amendment, he implied that the eighth report of the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration is:

[...] asking the House to debate it for a number of hours and decide whether we think it is within the scope of the bill [...]

As you know, Mr. Speaker, that is not at all the case. This report does not ask us to determine whether the proposed amendments are within the scope of the bill. On the contrary, as I will explain later on, the committee clearly showed that it knows the proposed amendments are outside the scope of the bill. The report asks the House to give the committee the power...

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

Madame Groguhé, I am going to ask you to stop for a second.

With all due respect, I would ask that if members have a conversation they want to carry on, they take it outside or turn down the volume, because it's very difficult to hear the speaker. I don't know if it's my earpiece that's faulty. I do have it turned to maximum, and I am having difficulty hearing. I'm just letting you know. So either carry on outside, please, or turn it down.

Ms. James.

[Roxanne James, Conservative, Scarborough Centre, ON]

I just want to let you know that I actually have trouble hearing, but I can hear fine, so it might be your earpiece.

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

It could be, but it's already turned up to maximum. I either get this huge echo or I don't hear anything. I could also hear the conversation clearly word for word. I'd rather not hear it.

Ms. Freeman.

[Mylène Freeman, NDP, Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC]

Sorry, Madam Chair. I don't want to waste any of your time. I was going to raise the same point of order. I'm literally sitting one chair away from the speaker right now and I could not hear her well.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

[Inaudible—Editor]

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

Can I finish with that point of order? Then I'll get back to you.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Sure.

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

As I said, Ms. Freeman, I have asked people to be quieter.

Mr. Dykstra.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Just on a point of order, Ms. Freeman was actually outside of the room; I would find it difficult to hear Madame Groguhé speak if I were out of the room. That's almost impossible to hear, when you're actually not here. That might have been part of the reason she couldn't hear.

[Mylène Freeman, NDP, Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC]

Madam Chair, just on what Mr. Dykstra has raised, I think when I returned from leaving the room, which I think I was within my rights to do, given that we were three members sitting here—I mean an extra member was sitting here—and we were five NDP members in the room.... I thought I was able to at least use the facilities—I'm going to try to be polite despite this late hour. When I returned to the room, I noticed the amount of noise and was about to raise it with the chair when she clearly had the same instinct.

I think the chair did settle that, and I'm glad to see everybody's back.

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

Thank you very much. The member is sitting in the chair right now.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

She should be able to hear now that she's back.

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

She was saying when she was sitting here she could not hear.

[Mylène Freeman, NDP, Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC]

For the record—

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

Okay, let's remember what I said earlier.

Ms. Sitsabaiesan.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

My understanding of O'Brien and Bosc and our Standing Orders in this place is that, just like in the House of Commons, you do not state whether a member is present or not present, whether that's in their seat in the chamber or in their seat in the committee; you don't actually point out whether a member is present or not.

I'm sure that our honourable colleagues on this committee are very well aware of this rule, and if any of the members of this committee need to use the facilities, need to get a drink of water—we're all human beings and our bodies have bodily functions that need to be taken care of, Madam Chair. I think people in this room can at least—at least—know that one rule because it's been raised in the House several times. I think everybody should know that rule by now, Madam Chair. Nevertheless, I will remind them all once again.

[The Vice-Chair (Ms. Jinny Jogindera Sims), NDP, Jinny Sims]

I have a speakers list, so I would encourage people....

Look, what has it got to now? We are making comments here about when somebody has gone out of the room and into the room. Everybody knows the rules. Let's just remember the rules.

I'm going to go over to Ms. James.