Evidence of meeting #42 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was safe.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Christiane Fox  Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
Michèle Kingsley  Assistant Deputy Minister, Operations, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
Clerk of the Committee  Ms. Stephanie Bond

1:05 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Salma Zahid

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 42 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration.

Today we will continue our study of the conditions faced by asylum seekers.

I just want to confirm that all witnesses have conducted the required technical tests in preparation for this meeting.

For our first panel in today's meeting, I would like to welcome the officials from IRCC. I would like to welcome Ms. Christiane Fox, deputy minister; Mr. Scott Harris, associate deputy minister; Jason Hollmann, acting director general, asylum policy; and Michèle Kingsley, assistant deputy minister, operations. The officials will have five minutes for their opening remarks.

Ms. Fox, you have the floor and you can begin. You will have five minutes for you opening remarks and then we will go to a round of questioning.

1:05 p.m.

Christiane Fox Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

That's perfect. Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

I want to start today by acknowledging that I am here on the traditional and unceded territories of the Algonquin Anishinabe peoples.

I am Christiane Fox, Deputy Minister for Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, or IRCC. I would like to thank the Committee for the invitation to appear. As mentioned, I am joined by Scott Harris, Michèle Kingsley, Operations and Jason Hollmann.

Canada is a top destination for people from all over the world who are seeking a better life. Our communities are welcoming, inclusive and diverse. Our economy provides many opportunities for work, and we offer an exceptional quality of life.

We have seen significant demand to come to Canada, with 2021 being a record-setting year for permanent immigration, with over 405,000 new permanent residents. The 2022 admissions are expected to pass 2021 in most immigration programs, including permanent residency, student visas, refugees and family reunifications.

And when Canada lifted its pandemic-related border measures earlier this fall, there was a renewed surge of asylum seekers, in particular at Roxham Road.

It is important to note that Canada’s asylum system and refugee resettlement program are separate. The asylum system is for people making refugee protection claims from within Canada.

Three organizations share the mandate for the asylum system: the Immigration and Refugee Board, the IRB, Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, or IRCC, and the Canada Border Services Agency, CBSA. Additionally, the RCMP plays an active role in policing the border between points of entry.

An asylum seeker entering a point of entry would be met by a CBSA officer. For irregular arrivals, an RCMP officer is the first point of contact upon crossing into Canada, before being transferred to CBSA to process their claim.

IRCC handles asylum claims by individuals already in Canada temporarily, possibly as a student or a visitor, who then decide to seek asylum.

Asylum seekers can make their claim at a port of entry upon arrival or online if they are already in Canada. If IRCC or CBSA determines that an individual is eligible to make an asylum claim, the claim is then referred to the IRB to assess whether the claimant requires Canada’s protection.

Individuals whose refugee claims are determined to be well-founded by the IRB receive protected person status in Canada and can apply for permanent residency.

If an individual’s refugee claim is determined to not be well founded, CBSA oversees the removal process. The individuals are released on condition to report for a future removal proceeding, which is managed by the CBSA.

Canada’s asylum system has been under significant strain due to sustained, high numbers of asylum claimants seeking our country’s protection. This year, Canada has already received over 62,000 asylum claims.

The Government of Canada continues to urge individuals to seek asylum in the first safe country they enter after fleeing persecution, as per the safe third country agreement, and not to resort to irregular crossings. Irregular routes can be dangerous and individuals may be subject to exploitation.

However, we do recognize that a large number of individuals have continued to enter Canada irregularly at Roxham Road.

In response, the government has set up capabilities to process arrivals, conduct safety verifications and health screenings, and ensure that migrants are assessed for eligibility of their applications.

IRCC has been working to support CBSA in addressing the backlog to determine eligibility and admissibility to Canada.

Budget 2022 provided asylum delivery partners with $1.3 billion over five years, and $331.2 million ongoing, to support the long-term stability and integrity of Canada’s asylum system. This funding will support a stronger system in the years ahead.

Recognizing that the determination process can take time and that higher volumes are causing delays, Canada provides asylum claimants support throughout the process.

The federal government has been providing temporary shelter to asylum seekers in Quebec and Ontario since the beginning of the pandemic at IRCC-leased hotels.

These facilities were initially established to support public health needs by providing newly arrived, asymptomatic claimants with an appropriate place to meet quarantine and testing requirements.

To support the Province of Quebec and City of Toronto, where the shelter networks have been overburdened with the increased volumes after November 2021, the government allowed claimants to stay in IRCC-leased hotels until a space was available in a shelter or claimants secured their own lodging.

The federal government has also provided support to provinces and municipalities through the temporary interim housing assistance program to reimburse some of the costs for housing asylum claimants—

1:05 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Salma Zahid

Ms. Fox, your time is up.

Can you quickly wind it up?

1:05 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

Absolutely.

I would close by saying that I want to thank the committee for your work to support a very strong asylum system to ensure that Canada remains one of the most welcoming countries in the world and for your work more broadly.

Being new to the department, I've been looking at the reports of the committee, and I look forward to working with all of you and taking your questions today.

Thank you very much, Chair.

1:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Salma Zahid

Thank you, Ms. Fox.

We will now go into our round of questioning. We will begin our round of questioning with Mr. Maguire.

Mr. Maguire, you will have six minutes for your round of questioning. You can please begin.

1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'm going to direct these questions to Ms. Fox.

Thank you for your testimony.

By being a signatory to the safe third country agreement, the Government of Canada's official position is that the United States is a safe third country.

Do you agree with that statement?

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

I do agree with that statement, yes.

1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

In the past 12 months, has IRCC ever issued a statement or press release or circulated anything to foreign media that unequivocally states that, in accordance with the safe third country agreement, individuals currently in the United States should be filing for asylum there rather than walking across the border?

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

I should take a look and see.

I joined the department in July. I can say that, since July, I have not seen any type of issuance from the department of that nature, but I can definitely do a check. Since I've been here, I have not seen that.

1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

If you find some, can you table that with the committee, all of the communications products?

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

Absolutely.

1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Thanks.

Are you aware that Minister Goodale stated in 2018 that the Government of Canada wanted to negotiate with the American government to amend the safe third country agreement?

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

I think that, in working very closely with the United States, we always stay in close contact with officials from the United States to make sure that, since the inception of the agreement in 2004—

1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Excuse me, but I have questions.

Were you aware that Minister Goodale in 2018 made that request?

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Have you ever been part of any conversation on current efforts—this is more likely what you were looking at—to amend the safe third country agreement?

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

Our department has been in contact with officials from the United States, yes. I personally have not yet.

1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Has IRCC ever conducted any analysis or had any discussions on the specific language needed to amend the safe third country agreement so individuals cannot walk across the border to claim asylum?

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

IRCC has been looking at the agreement in working with the U.S., absolutely.

Have we written any paragraphs in terms of changes to it? Not at this stage, but we have been working very closely on the context.

1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

You haven't put any specific language down to amend it and stop them from coming across the border.

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

No, we have not put such language down.

1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Can you please ask your officials to inquire if IRCC has produced any reports, memos or analysis on what would be needed to amend the safe third country agreement so individuals cannot walk across the border to claim asylum? Table that with this committee.

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

Yes, we have definitely done some work in that regard, and we definitely can table that with the committee.

November 18th, 2022 / 1:10 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

You've had reports. Okay. If you could do that, please, that would be helpful.

Are you aware that in 2018 Minister Hussen—after Mr. Goodale—travelled to other countries such as Nigeria to discourage people from flying to the United States for the sole purpose of walking across the border to claim asylum in Canada?

1:10 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

Christiane Fox

I am aware that ministers did go—I think you referenced Minister Hussen in Nigeria—to share information about the asylum system in this country. Yes, absolutely.