Citizenship and Immigration Committee on March 22nd, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We will now proceed to Ms. Lalonde.

Ms. Lalonde, you will have five minutes. Please begin.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I note that all your testimony today really is based on facts. It is also very compassionate, and I see a deep desire to continue to improve the situation, as well.

You alluded to the need to add new resources, particularly when it comes to consular personnel. In her testimony, the minister referred to funds associated with her primary role.

Can you tell us a bit about these new resources? I would like to get a few more details on that subject.

How is that going to improve matters in relation to everything we have learned and what we have to continue doing, not just for Afghanistan, but also for other countries?

[Julie Sunday]

Thanks for the question, Madam Chair.

Yes, we were very pleased to receive resources. A key part of these resources will be developed toward building our surge response capacity. Importantly, we will have a standing emergency response team that will focus on being primed to move quickly. They will be providing training across our network. We will continue to build our resources and consular emergency capacity at missions as well.

Importantly, we are also, as part of this, really working to modernize our tools. This is part of communicating better with Canadians, using new digital platforms to do that—we're already using WhatsApp in an emergency—and trying to become a bit more agile.

Of course, we provide our excellent travel advice. We have the ROCA list, the registration of Canadians abroad. We want to be able to access Canadians, particularly in crisis situations, so that we're able to provide them with the most relevant information.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Thank you for that detailed answer.

I would like to come back to what we are feeling as a result of some of the decisions being made by this current terrorist regime, in terms of our Canadian values and especially the treatment of young women and girls. We believe the way women are treated by the Taliban is inconceivable and completely unacceptable.

I would like to know how Global Affairs Canada is reacting to the restrictions imposed by local authorities concerning women's involvement in humanitarian aid. We were talking earlier about Bill C‑41 and we know now that there are restrictions.

I would like to hear your comments on this subject, if you would like to share them.

[Weldon Epp]

Thank you for the question.

I want to begin by stating what I think we all feel, which is that all Canadians strongly condemn the actions of the Taliban regime, most recently in December, to drastically restrict the rights of women and girls to participate and work. As the minister stated earlier, this has also dramatically impacted the way in which we work with such channels and partners, as we do already have, that we can work with under the circumstances.

To answer the question, we have done a number of things. Number one, the minister has led for Canada, joining with other governments and other ministers, in condemning these new lows, if you like, in terms of human rights abuses by the Taliban regime at every occasion. I think she spoke to that earlier.

As well, to complement what she said, we do have a special representative for Afghanistan, former ambassador Sproule. He is based in Doha and works tirelessly with other special representatives in coordinating with the UN agencies in communicating, as appropriate, with representatives of the Taliban under very difficult circumstances in order to understand, and to make sure they understand, the implications of these actions.

Finally, we've been in close contact with a range of non-governmental organizations that still have activity on the ground—for example, the Aga Khan Foundation.

What I would say is this: It's a terrible situation and it has gotten worse and more difficult, but at the same time, Afghanistan is not a unitary operating zone. There is some differentiation between how these new edicts are being implemented within Kabul and certain metropolitan centres, if you will, and in other parts of the country. We're tracking closely with our partners to see the extent to which humanitarian assistance, health assistance and education assistance can continue to be delivered to and through women even while the Taliban's official position has changed.

We continue to monitor it closely and we look to work as we can with those partners.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

The time is up.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Thank you for that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We will now proceed to Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe.

You have two and a half minutes. Please begin.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I sometimes agree with my friend Ms. Rempel Garner, and I want to say that the commemorative plaque, in my opinion, is a nice gesture of recognition for the people who worked night and day and put all their heart and energy into trying to save as many people as possible. It has the support of the Bloc Québécois in that regard.

Under Bill C‑41, your department, or Citizenship and Immigration, will have responsibility for determining whether the proposed activity responds to a real and important need in an area reported to be under the control of a terrorist group.

Since you are the one who will decide whether or not authorizations will be given, I would like to know whether you have already established the criteria that will be used to determine whether the objectives have been achieved.

I would ask that Ms. Loten answer, given her in‑depth knowledge of Bill C‑41.

[Jennifer Loten]

Thanks for the question.

The legislation has in it a set of criteria for the kinds of undertakings that will be given protection from criminal liability. The reason for that is to make sure that the central objective in the Criminal Code is protected, which is to prevent financing to terrorist organizations.

It's not a door wide open for any kind of activity to be undertaken. It's the kinds of things that are essential and that are humanitarian. We have widened it to include health care and education. Those are the kinds of criteria that we're looking for. Is it an essential activity in the sense that it fits within the scope of activities that the legislation is designed to address?

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you.

We have talked a lot about the fact that several departments are involved and that we might end up wasting time.

Do you agree with me that, simply as a matter of practicality and speed, there should be a single window, a one-stop shop, so that non-governmental organizations, or NGOs, do not have to apply to three different departments?

[Jennifer Loten]

Yes, it's a great idea.

We're working on—once the legislation is completed and runs through its process in Parliament—being able to pick up and start applying them as quickly as possible.

Yes, there are three departments involved. I can assure you that we work very closely together. The idea is that the public-facing element will be a single face. From there, different departments will take control of the elements that relate to their mandates.

For example, Global Affairs will take a look in the first instance. Where we have a request that needs to be channelled towards IRCC, we'll do that. Then we will look at the piece that pertains to our work. Then we make a recommendation that will go over to Public Safety.

We're trying as much as possible to streamline. Where we can, we're also seeking to—

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

NGOs will therefore have to submit their applications to just one place. That's perfect.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Your time is up.

[Jennifer Loten]

Yes, that's our intention.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you.

We will now go to Ms. Kwan.

You can please begin. You will have two and a half minutes.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much.

I want to go back to the last question I asked.

It was mentioned that the department is not aware of anybody having been sent back, but it knows that people have been fined. I'm aware of people who have disappeared. Whether they have been sent back or whatever happened to them, the families can't find them. They've lost contact. Not good things are happening from that perspective. I guess I want to come back to this.

Are there individuals for whom the departments have worked, perhaps collaboratively with IRCC, so that individuals without valid visas or expired visas have found a path to safety in Canada?

[Weldon Epp]

I'm going to ask Chris to respond to this.

[Christopher Gibbins, Executive Director, Afghanistan-Pakistan, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

That question is really best placed for IRCC to respond.

As far as we are aware, yes, there will have been some individuals. That is part of the very extensive conversations we have with the Government of Pakistan to work collaboratively with them, because there are Afghans who make their way into Pakistan without the required documents. If they are part of the Canadian program, then we will work with the Government of Pakistan to get them out.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you.

I raise this question because the Minister of Immigration was on record as saying that if you don't have a valid visa, you would not be considered as having a valid application in Canada. I hope that position has changed, because by nature, people who are refugees and fleeing persecution are not going to necessarily have valid papers. That cannot be a reason that they can't be considered for an application to get to safety, so I hope the department will work with the ministry of immigration to work through this, because that does not make any sense.

Can I get the officials to provide to committee information on how many individuals, particularly women's organizations, received funding from GAC or the Canadian government in advancing rights? How many of those individuals are there?

Of those, how many received a referral from GAC towards the 40,000 special immigration measure?

[Weldon Epp]

Thank you for the question.

I'm going to try to answer. I have some data here, so bear with me. I'll provide what I can.

For the first part of the question, with respect, I don't think we'll be able to answer in the sense of.... Given the decades that Canada has worked in the country, a full list of all the beneficiaries of the programming we did would be an enormous list.

What we are working on in the role that GAC has played is that as referrals come forward, either through third parties or directly, we assess those criteria. Of those, Global Affairs has been able to refer thousands to IRCC—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting. Time is up for Ms. Kwan. Please wrap up.

[Weldon Epp]

I believe, Madam Chair, that we'd be happy to provide the data in terms of how many referrals have been made and for how many of those referrals IRCC has been able to offer invitations to apply.

We can provide that data. I'd be happy to do so not on your time.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

I wonder if I can ask the officials, Madam Chair, if they can try to see if they can get the data, as much as they can—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Mr. Epp has said that he will try to provide it.