Citizenship and Immigration Committee on March 27th, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 56 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration.

Before we resume the consideration of Bill S-245, I would like to ask for the committee's approval of the study budgets and discuss the calendar briefly so we can schedule the studies.

The first thing I need to ask the committee members is this: Is it the will of the committee to approve a budget of $7,250 for the study of Bill S-245, an act to amend the Citizenship Act regarding granting citizenship to certain Canadians?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Is it the will of the committee to approve a budget of $1,500 for the study of the main estimates 2023-24?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Just to give a little glance of the upcoming meetings and the budget and some dates we need to be mindful of, this coming Wednesday the Minister of Justice and Minister of Defence will appear with officials for one panel each on the Afghanistan study. That is the meeting on Wednesday, March 29.

We go into two break weeks, so the next meeting after March 29 will be April 17. In order to respect the deadline of April 26, clause-by-clause consideration of Bill S-245 is scheduled for April 17, 2023. We have to take it back to the House before April 26. Amendments must be sent to the clerk by March 31, 2023. That will be this Friday.

Is everyone okay that we do this clause-by-clause on April 17, so that we respect the deadline Parliament has given to us? Good.

Senator McPhedran has accepted the committee's invitation to appear on Wednesday, April 19 for two hours on the Afghanistan study. She is already scheduled in. For Monday, April 24, Minister Harjit Sajjan is unavailable, but he has confirmed his availability on Wednesday, April 26. On Monday, April 26, we are already scheduled with Minister Fraser and officials. They confirmed that they are available to appear on April 26 on the main estimates.

How would the committee like to proceed?

I would like to get the committee's guidance on which study to prioritize. Minister Fraser was scheduled to come before the committee for the mains, but Minister Sajjan has also given the date of April 26.

Mr. Redekopp.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Is there any possibility of getting Minister Fraser here on the Monday rather than the Wednesday?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

On Monday we have given the dates, so we are waiting for an answer. We have given Marco Mendicino two dates, which are April 24 and May 1. We are waiting for confirmation to come from these two ministers.

I would like to have Minister Mendicino on whichever date he is free—either May 1 or April 24.

Let me give you another.... For April 26, how would the committee members like to proceed? Should we proceed with Minister Harjit Sajjan and reschedule the Minister for Immigration, or continue with the Minister for Immigration and we will have to get some date...?

Are there any comments?

Mrs. Lalonde.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Madam Chair, I would like to maybe mention that there's a strong possibility that the dates you are presenting to us as a possible switch for Minister Fraser may not be available.

He had secured this date again. He has been amazing in always attending our committee. April 26 is the date that I think they have secured with our officials.

I would like the committee to certainly look at this motion. I know the timeline is April 30, but maybe there's a little bit of leeway that we could propose to our chair, particularly on the motion.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

We would be okay with that. We haven't had the minister here for a little while. We have had other ministers. I think that would be okay.

The only request I would make is that we try to get through Michelle's motion as quickly as possible right after that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

For that, I would like to put the schedule in front of you.

The Honourable Marc Garneau has accepted the date of May 3. He will only appear for an hour. He has confirmed that date.

We have to get through Bill S-245, if we are not looking for an extension from the House. We will finish the clause-by-clause on the 17th. Five meetings cannot happen on that motion before April 30.

I would request the members to please allow to extend the date beyond April 30 to work and fit in those five meetings. Is that okay?

Ms. Kwan.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

It's just a question on clause-by-clause. I understand that April 17 is slotted for that. Then the whole thing needs to be done by April 26. The 19th is already scheduled for a different piece with the senator. What happens if on the 17th we're not done the clause-by-clause?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Ms. Kwan, that's a very valid question. I was going to come to that.

We have to report it back to the House by the 26th. Based on the schedule, if it's the will of the committee members that we finish this legislation, if we don't ask for an extension and extend the date for the motion, what we can do is this. If we don't finish it on the 17th, then we can go to the 19th and do that. We would reschedule Senator McPhedran.

Right now, for Wednesday, April 19, Senator McPhedran is scheduled. If we cannot finish the clause-by-clause on the 17th, and the will of the committee members is to finish this legislation and report back to the House before April 26, then we can schedule another meeting on the 19th.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

The legislation should be first.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Is everyone agreed on that?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We are trying to do the schedule. We are waiting for the date from Minister Marco Mendicino. Marc Garneau has already given a date. We will have to reschedule Minister Sajjan's date if the will of the committee members is to have the Minister of Immigration on the 26th.

Madam Clerk, can you work on these dates?

We will try to schedule those meetings on the motion that was presented by Michelle Rempel Garner as quickly as possible.

Is that okay with everyone?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you.

Yes, we have Ms. Lalonde.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Maybe I misunderstood, so I want to clarify. My understanding is Minister Sajjan had confirmed the 26th for the motions presented. We already had Minister Fraser scheduled. I was under the impression—I apologize for this misunderstanding—that we are wanting to see Minister Sajjan on the 26th, and we'll just allow the time, when it occurs, for Minister Fraser to come. I just want clarification from my colleagues.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

What Mr. Redekopp said was that we should have the Minister of Immigration on the 26th and reschedule Minister Sajjan. He's already scheduled to appear before the committee on the 26th. It's to have Minister Fraser come in, and then reschedule Minister Sajjan.

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Through you, I really don't know the position of Minister Sajjan, and with the fact that we have not seen him here, I would encourage that maybe the member consider having him come, since he is available on the 26th.

I know that Minister Fraser may not have availability other than the 26th. Considering the importance of maybe.... Like I said, I just want to make sure that everybody understands we're saying no to Minister Sajjan.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Ms. Kwan, you have the floor.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Why don't we proceed this way? We obviously want both ministers to come before the committee. I think for the main estimates it's important for the minister to come before us. I also think it's important to have Minister Sajjan come before us. Why don't we then try to switch whomever, in order to ensure that we can secure a different date for whichever minister? For example, let's say, if, on the 26th, we're going to have Minister Fraser, and if we're able to secure a date with Minister Sajjan, let's say, in May, then we should move him to May.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We'll request that. That's based on today's discussion.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Yes, based on the availability....