Citizenship and Immigration Committee on March 3rd, 2022

[Jasraj Singh Hallan, Conservative, Calgary Forest Lawn, AB]

The system cannot handle that right now. Is there something we can do within our infrastructure to have that ready to go for other countries if a war broke out in other countries?

[Catrina Tapley]

Madam Chair, I will come back to the fact that there are lots of reasons we have a visa on specific countries, so we will come back to looking at security issues in a country and looking at their rate of immigration violations. We have a framework that looks at visas there. It's a pretty transparent framework, and I'm happy to share with the committee the issues we look at and how we do that or how we would even move to something like the eTA 2.0 that we have with Brazil.

[Jasraj Singh Hallan, Conservative, Calgary Forest Lawn, AB]

Can we also get the officials, Madam Chair, to table.... There were applications that were pending and just stuck from Afghanistan, not just for interpreters but for the Sikh, Hindu and Hazara communities prior to the fall of Kabul.

I asked the minister previously as well. Those people do not see any hope of coming to Canada anymore, because they don't see any priority given to Afghans.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting, Mr. Hallan.

[Jasraj Singh Hallan, Conservative, Calgary Forest Lawn, AB]

Can we please have the numbers tabled?

[Catrina Tapley]

Of course, Madam Chair.

[Jasraj Singh Hallan, Conservative, Calgary Forest Lawn, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, Madam Tapley.

Time is up. We will now proceed to MP Ali for five minutes.

MP Ali, please proceed.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you to the officials for being here.

I have one question. Could you please walk us through visa applications from Pakistan and refugee applications from Afghanistan? In which countries are those processed, and would you give any consideration to moving those visa services back to the Islamabad office, please?

[Catrina Tapley]

One of the beauties of having electronic applications is that we can move those applications throughout our system, so if we have some spare capacity in Beijing or some spare capacity in Ottawa, Mississauga, Sydney or wherever in our network, we're able to absolutely be the most efficient possible in terms of how we process those applications. Having all applications for a particular area in a particular spot makes it more difficult for us to do that.

There are some reasons for needing local expertise on specific applications. There may be reasons for interviews around that, where we want to move it in. It's just a little more complicated than simply saying that we should process all applications from X country in X spot. Just giving us the flexibility to do that really helps us better meet our service standards.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Through Madam Chair, I have a follow-up on the same question. We have a facility in Islamabad. Why is it not being used? If we're going electronic, then why do we have different visa offices in different countries?

[Catrina Tapley]

Madam Chair, I want to assure the honourable member that we are using our facilities in Islamabad. We have an office in Islamabad. We have 13 Canada-based officers there, I believe. We are processing there, but we are also processing those applications elsewhere. We are using it to our full capacity.

The other thing we use in Islamabad is our visa application centre, so we're able to collect biometrics and we're able to do other things there. Those things all work in concert together.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you.

I have one more brief follow-up question. Do we do the interviews there as well, in Islamabad, or do the applicants have to travel to different countries?

[Catrina Tapley]

No, we do interviews in Islamabad. We have done some interviews virtually during the pandemic. That has worked out very well. I think it provides much better client service, but we would do interviews in Islamabad, absolutely.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you so much.

One of my constituents is from Afghanistan. He has three brothers who live close to Kabul. They have applied under the refugee stream given the current situation, but they haven't received any response from IRCC. My office tried to reach out to IRCC. We can't get any answer from them.

Would you please walk us through whether there's anything we can do for people who have close relations in Afghanistan?

[Catrina Tapley]

Madam Chair, we have our existing programs and we work through those. However, in terms of special programming for Afghanistan and what we've done, we have a big commitment around those who served Canada either with the military or with Global Affairs who were there. We have a second commitment that's focused on government-assisted refugees and privately sponsored refugees of Afghans who have fled and who are outside of Afghanistan.

We also have, as I think the honourable member has noted, a considerable existing inventory of Afghans seeking protection, who are there and seeking to come through those streams.

The third is the family reunification stream that we've stood up for individuals who came out in 2009 and 2012.

Those are the three streams that we're looking at for Afghans—

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you.

I have only 30 seconds, so it's a quick question.

What mechanisms were in place and what additional effort went into achieving the immigration level for 2021?

Can you respond to that quickly, please?

[Catrina Tapley]

We used a lot of innovative practices. It came down to focusing on what was achievable and what was possible. That was looking at landings for many who were already in Canada—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting, Ms. Tapley. The time is up for Mr. Ali.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We will now proceed with Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe for two and a half minutes.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Thank you again to the witnesses for being with us.

When you point out the problem of the backlog of 25,000 skilled workers who are still waiting for a response, for which even lawyers are suing you, you make excuses.

When you are told that using artificial intelligence really does pose risks of discrimination for francophones, you say you are comfortable with that. That's what we heard at a previous meeting.

When you are told that the approval rate for international students is 90% for McGill University, but that it is 21% for the Université du Québec à Trois‑Rivières, 29% for the Université du Québec à Rimouski, 40% for the Université du Québec à Chicoutimi and around 55% for Université Laval, you still seem to want to find excuses that make sense to you.

In light of all that, I wonder if the problem in your department isn't rather its inability to recognize that there are problems. First and foremost, you have to recognize and name the problems if you want to address them. I get the impression that everything is excused, that there are always reasons that you think are rational and valid.

I'd like someone to tell me whether there's an issue with recognizing the problems within your department.

[Catrina Tapley]

Thank you for the question.

I have to say that I struggle with that question.

You have to ask yourself what we are looking at when we approve student applications. The first thing we're looking at is if this person really wants to come to Canada to study. Where is their acceptance from the institution? Is this a legitimate student application?

The second thing we look at is whether this student can support themselves when they're in Canada. They have to be able to show us that they're able to support themselves when they're here. We have heard stories about this. Student fees are high. The average student fee for an international student is $34,000 a year. If they can't demonstrate to us that they're able to support themselves, then they're open to big vulnerability.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Excuse me, Madam Chair.

Once again, I'm being told that the students who want to study at the Université du Québec à Trois‑Rivières are unable to support themselves, while students who want to study at McGill University can. That answer makes no sense, Madam Chair. Again, it's an irrational answer.

[Catrina Tapley]

Actually, it depends on the country of origin.

There are different approval rates for different countries, but we're looking at the same things when we go through this.

Can you support yourself? Are you showing us an intention that if things don't work out for you in Canada, you're prepared to go home at the end?