Evidence of meeting #92 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was employers.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
I would like the office to have the powers to compel companies to co-operate with the ombudsperson's office, first and foremost, and then expand the sectors. It's currently limited, as you are well aware, to certain sectors, and I think that leaves a gap in various others. I would expand the scope of the sectors.
Those are the two key areas that I can think of at this stage.
Liberal
Paul Chiang Liberal Markham—Unionville, ON
Thank you.
When you visited Canada, what specific streams of temporary foreign workers did you examine? You mentioned you were concerned about the low-wage and agriculture streams of the temporary foreign worker program. Were there any other programs you looked into?
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
In terms of the temporary foreign worker program, I have spoken to stakeholders, including workers for—
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.
We no longer have interpretation.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
We no longer had interpretation, but the technical issue has been resolved. Thank you.
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
I also spoke to workers and stakeholders in domestic work and the shellfish industries, including processing. These are areas I also had a chance to explore.
Liberal
Paul Chiang Liberal Markham—Unionville, ON
You looked into different programs. What were your thoughts on those other programs, such as the foreign workers in the seafood industry?
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
The working conditions of the workers I've spoken to are quite similar, whether it's agriculture or [Inaudible—Editor], in terms of instances of abuse and exploitation reported. That is not to say all employees are in this situation. I've also spoken to workers who didn't experience any exploitation and abuse.
However, I think the closed nature of the program is an issue, inherently.
Liberal
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sukh Dhaliwal
Thank you, Mr. Chiang.
We will now go to Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe for six minutes.
Please go ahead.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Obokata, for joining us today for this important study.
I will try to put things in context and reassure people, including some of my colleagues.
You raised the fact that the closed work permit system could be fertile ground for modern slavery in Canada. I understood that you were not attacking employers, businesses or agricultural producers, but rather questioning the system that allows certain abuses. You were not targeting employers, but rather the closed permit system.
Can you explain that difference to the committee please?
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
Thank you.
Yes, I think there is that kind of structural issue, in terms of the closed nature of the program and tying workers to specific employers. As I said, it was not my intention to state that all employers are exploiting workers. I haven't found that evidence. However, there are instances.
That gap in the system can be taken advantage of by some employers, yes.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
We see that Quebec has an extremely high number of temporary foreign workers. I think that number is close to 500,000 workers.
It is said that 95% of employers are good employers, but that does leave 5% who are not. Even if that portion was only 1%, vulnerable people would still be at risk of being abused.
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
Of course, from my point of view, even one victim is an important issue. Certainly, if 95% of employers in Quebec are good, I'd like to commend that. However, this still leaves about 5% who are not actually complying with the existing employment standards legislation.
The onus is on the provincial government and the federal government to properly take action against those remaining ones.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
An initiative specific to Quebec was created in 2018 called the Table de concertation sur les différents enjeux sur les travailleurs temporaires agricoles—an issue table on temporary foreign agricultural workers.
This initiative's aim is to meet specific objectives, such as helping to improve and promote overall working, health and safety conditions for workers. The table is also proactive in providing a reminder of the rights of foreign agricultural workers.
Would it not be a good idea for the rest of Canada to follow the example of the organizations that created this issue table so that it becomes a model to be put in place in the other Canadian provinces and territories?
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
Thank you very much.
Yes, I very much support what you have done. A multi-stakeholder approach is extremely important in order to listen to the voices of workers and stakeholders, and that's the [Technical difficulty—Editor].
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sukh Dhaliwal
Hold on.
Mr. Obokata, your reception on our end is not very clear. There's static. Give us a minute.
February 26th, 2024 / 11:30 a.m.
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
Can you hear me now?
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
I commend that type of multi-stakeholder approach that exists in Quebec. I certainly encourage other provinces to consider the participation of other stakeholders, including workers. It is of vital importance in developing appropriate programs and strategies so that everyone—workers, businesses and local authorities—can benefit from the program.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
In your consultations, did you have a chance to speak with Quebec's minister of immigration, francization and integration?
Special Rapporteur on Contemporary Forms of Slavery, United Nations, As an Individual
No, I have not had a chance to do that.
Bloc
Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe Bloc Lac-Saint-Jean, QC
Quebec is the only province in Canada with a shared jurisdiction. Quebec has certain powers with respect to immigration thanks to an agreement signed in 1991 between Canada and Quebec.
Quebec is asking to be granted all immigration powers. This is a unanimous request. All the parties represented in the National Assembly are calling for Quebec to have more immigration powers. Some people tell us that this would, at least in Quebec, solve the problem of the closed permit system in the temporary foreign worker program.
Are you aware of that? If so, do you think it would at least be something that could be resolved if Quebec had more immigration powers?