Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Oct. 9th, 2025

[Sameer Zuberi, Liberal, Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC]

Would you say that universities make extra efforts, compared to these bad actors, when it comes to supporting students about the cost of living and the related expenses and to projecting the expenses they will need to live on their own? Do universities do a better job than these bad actors, in terms of helping students understand the costs to study here, away from home?

[Rob Kristofferson]

I think it's likely certain that it's the case. I think the larger picture is that universities are institutions with long-term time horizons. They operate on five-year plans, but they hire their instructors on much longer durations. We need to sync up federal and provincial policies—and with universities—in a way that actually works on those time horizons instead of—

[Sameer Zuberi, Liberal, Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC]

You said that it likely is the case. Would you be able to get back to the committee with a bit of research on whether it actually is the case so that we can include that in our study?

[Rob Kristofferson]

Sure.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Michelle Rempel]

Thank you, Mr. Zuberi.

We'll now go over to Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe for six minutes.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I thank the witnesses for being here to discuss this important study.

Mr. Kristofferson, in the late 1990s and early 2000s, the federal government slashed provincial transfers in order to balance its budget. As a result, the provinces had to make tough choices in areas like health and education, and they had to cut costs as well.

Funding that was cut was never reinstated. What impact is that having on your universities now?

[Rob Kristofferson]

I'm seeing massive consequences. I've been teaching at the university level for 35 years, and I've been a student for longer than that. Class sizes have exploded. Available resources and teaching support have dwindled.

We have critiques levied about how outrageous it is that there's a professor teaching a class of only 15 students or something like that. That's actually an ideal learning environment, a fleeting one that is rare to see in today's universities. It's something that those of us who have worked their way through the university system hearken back to, really value and would love to see restored.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

I realize the current government wants to blame the provinces for education cuts, but I think we can all agree the cuts happened because the government wanted to balance its budget. Paul Martin happened to be a master of that. Thank you for your answer.

The federal government regularly boasts about investing in universities, but it is mainly investing in research programs, such as Canada research chairs and the Canadian Foundation for Innovation. Universities compete for those funds. Does that mean some larger English universities get more than others?

My question is for Mr. Kristofferson.

[Rob Kristofferson]

I'm sorry. What is the inequity you're talking about?

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Maybe we haven't been hearing the same things you, but people on the ground tell us that access to funding for these programs is very competitive. Some universities end up with more than others. Can you comment on that?

[Rob Kristofferson]

If you're talking to the tri-council grants and things like that, it has become more competitive over recent decades. A lot of time and effort are put in by my colleagues in trying to obtain those monies. If we were able to access a larger pool of opportunity in that regard, for the whole system—the country, society and the economy—there would be multiple beneficiaries.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

I have another question for you, Mr. Kristofferson. That doesn't mean I don't like the other two witnesses, but I really like your answers.

In your opinion, is the federal research funding system equitable for researchers working or publishing in French?

[Rob Kristofferson]

That's not really in my jurisdiction. We have a national organization that would be better positioned to comment on that. I'm sorry.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

A recent report on the television show Enquête, which is very popular in Quebec, revealed that an international criminal organization is taking advantage of gaps in the study permit system. You may not have seen that report, but the University of Ottawa was identified as being a victim of this crime ring, which uses the international student program to bring bad actors into the country. I don't know if you were briefed on the report, but it really made waves in Quebec.

Citizenship and Immigration Canada's response to the report was astonishing. It was very surprising—catastrophic, even. An IRCC spokesperson reacting to the report blamed universities for this phenomenon. He even blamed the Government of Quebec by extension.

What was your reaction when you heard that? If this is the first time you're hearing about it, what's your reaction to an IRCC spokesperson saying that kind of thing?

[Rob Kristofferson]

My reaction is that I'm now going to go and read all that I can about it.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Well, you should, because your university is named specifically. It's unfortunate that you haven't seen the report.

Have you observed any irregularities in study permit applications that would lead you to believe a crime ring is using the international student program to get into Canada and is targeting your university?

[Rob Kristofferson]

OCUFA is a faculty association, a provincial organization, and we're not directly involved in the administrative apparatus of universities, so I don't get a view onto that.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Mr. Kristofferson, I have one last question for you. The federal government has one set of measures that don't necessarily take into account realities in different jurisdictions, such as Quebec and the provinces. In your opinion, should those measures be adjusted depending on the jurisdiction?

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Michelle Rempel]

Give a brief answer, please.

[Rob Kristofferson]

Well, I think what's before the committee is trying to find a solution to an incredibly complex set of factors that need to fit together, but I think that's what we need to do: to all knuckle down—

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Michelle Rempel]

Thank you. I'm going to have to cut you off there.

We're going over to Mr. Redekopp for a five-minute round.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. Tibbits, in 2024, Conestoga had over 30,000 international students. That's about 75% of your student population. It's safe to say that you had one of the largest enrolments, if not the largest, of international students among colleges in Canada. Is that correct?

[John Tibbits]

I think so, yes.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Okay. It's also safe, then, to assume the federal government was aware of Conestoga and its impact. Did the federal government come to you in 2023 or 2024 with concerns about the massive growth in international students?

[John Tibbits]

No.