Evidence of meeting #55 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 39th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was process.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Okanese First Nation, Federation of Saskatchewan Indian Nations
Chief Marie-Anne Day Walker-Pelletier
I share the same frustration as my colleague, but I think you really need to know that these issues are real. I have been chief for 26 consecutive years and I've witnessed and seen how governments try to not recognize our unique status in this country and how for me, as a first nations woman, Bill C-31 has affected my grandchildren and possibly my great grandchildren, who will not have status.
Is that the whole purpose of the government--to take away all our rights, to use these measures of amendments, legislation, policy, whatever, to make us all equal to Canadians, to take my treaty rights away through these special legislative measures? That's what it seems like, and I am talking openly here, that we're being violated. Policies and legislation are put in, and now we have the results 20 years later of Bill C-31. How many of our grandchildren are going to be first nations, have treaty numbers, and have treaty rights?
So that is why we're here--to speak on behalf of those kids who are unborn, those children who require attention and special rights in the future, so we don't lose that. When we speak, we speak for our communities. We speak about those real issues, those real impacts--the lack of housing, the results of Bill C-31 again on our children and our families, child and family services where kids were adopted out. I am facing those same issues. There are kids who are 30 years old now and don't know who they are. They don't have a treaty right. They were put in foster care. Their culture and their language have been taken away from them, and we're trying to restore it, re-evaluate, and try to bring them back into our communities. There are never enough resources to sustain and help our people.
We need recognition. We need the government to allow first nations communities to design and to deliberate and to enact their own legislation within their communities, within their treaty territories. It's not for government to decide for me how I'm going to live. It's me, my community, and my council to decide and design how it is that we're going to work with Canada and maybe use their laws. But the decision has to come from my community and nobody else.
I think it is very important that somehow we have to find a way to work together.
Thank you.
Conservative
Conservative
Rod Bruinooge Conservative Winnipeg South, MB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I thank the witnesses for coming today.
Perhaps I will start with Rose. We've had a chance to meet a few times in the past.
Perhaps I'll start by indicating that you mentioned you wanted the truth put on the table. I agree that is the essential part of any conversation. So I'll have to let you know that I think there are people who were being untruthful to you when they said that you weren't going to be able to meet today. That was never going to occur. In fact, it was the exact opposite. There would have been a great extension of this meeting had the Speaker not ruled the way he did this morning. But I'll put that aside. It was just for the sake of truth.
Anyway, going forward from there, we also met this summer in August in Grande Prairie, I believe it was, and I indicated to you that I was very interested in moving forward on systemic reform. This is an area that we're currently talking about today, where individuals will be able to bring forward complaints, for instance, as Mr. Merasty indicated, on the government or anybody in Canada who they feel is infringing on their human rights. By extending that forum to first nations people, it's my opinion that we'll be doing something that will benefit first nations people.
I guess that's my perspective. What's your position on the way I've laid it out?
Driftpile First Nation
I had a hard time hearing the first part of your comments.
I recommend that we create a task force to address the concerns around collective versus individual rights, and to look at dealing with the outcomes. We don't want to be stuck again in the realm of Bill C-31, the consequences of that, and how it played out. We need to examine this and look at the outcomes. I think that would be a good starting point.
Conservative
Rod Bruinooge Conservative Winnipeg South, MB
To go further on that, the challenge of human rights in the Canadian context is that they come down to the opinion of the individual, as to whether or not they feel they are being violated. So in the future, it will be challenging for any of us to say what some individual, 15 to 20 years from now, living in a city, on reserve, or anywhere, might consider to be an infringement of their human rights. If they truly feel violated, it's difficult for us to say that they don't feel that way.
That's the biggest challenge in trying to ascertain a scope to the definition of human rights. It makes it challenging also to have any one group able to identify that.
Perhaps you could give me your thoughts on what a human right is.
Conservative
Rod Bruinooge Conservative Winnipeg South, MB
If you had the opportunity to define a human right, would you be able to give it some definition?
Driftpile First Nation
Given the time and the opportunity to really examine and analyze all of this, yes, I probably could.
But at the same time, I remember you very clearly when we met in Grand Prairie. Do you know why? Because you were very proud of who you were. I made a comment to you at that time about this being all that I want for my children, my grandchildren, first nation children, and those yet unborn: to be as proud as you were that day about who you were.
In the context of individual versus the collective, when I look at the occurrences that are going to happen on an individual scale and the amount of time it's going to take to have the tribunal or whoever will listen to all of these, it's going to be next to impossible. We really need to evaluate and strategize how we're going to do this at the end of the day.
As I said earlier, I don't have a problem with the principle behind it. But please, don't force this on us. At the end of the day, I'm not taking the responsibility for someone else. I'm not taking the responsibility for the two percent cap, for example, and rent going sky high.
I'm not able to send any new students to university this year. The budget just doesn't allow it. But I have to live with it. I have to live in that community, where these human rights accusations may occur.
But until you know the whole story behind it, it's going to be next to impossible to justify the decisions that will mean being at a different end. Then I'm going to have to accommodate it, or do what I need to do. This will probably take some kind of resourcing that I don't have.
So I need to let this table know that if a decision is made, and this goes forward, I am not taking the financial responsibility or burden of the outcomes. I need to state that here.
Conservative
Rod Bruinooge Conservative Winnipeg South, MB
Just as some further background, and this doesn't necessarily apply to the future, the amount of human rights cases that might come after Bill C-44 is put in place is somewhat unpredictable.
There are about 18 first nations communities that have negotiated self-government agreements, where their communities live under the Canadian Human Rights Act. According to the Canadian Human Rights Commission, they have not seen a disproportionate amount of violations coming forward.
Over time, as the opportunity becomes known to first nations people, they will know that there is this vehicle for them to consider.
As background, this is the evidence that was brought forward in this committee.
Driftpile First Nation
The modern-day self-government agreements are totally in a different context from the treaties that are there and solid.
Conservative
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes
We're finished with the first round and we're going to move into our five-minute round.
Before we start, I wanted to announce that we do have lunch. We invite our witnesses, if they wish to have some lunch with us, to go ahead. It's at the back there, and you can take the time to do that.
Mr. Merasty is next.
Liberal
Gary Merasty Liberal Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I have some short and sweet questions. One of the things I'm concerned with is the messaging and how this is being played out, because I do truly believe there is an assignment of blame to first nations leadership on many of these issues.
Chief Laboucan, is it your fault that no services for children with disabilities are provided on your reserve?
Liberal
Gary Merasty Liberal Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK
Is it your fault that no services for children with disabilities are provided on your reserve, Chief?
Okanese First Nation, Federation of Saskatchewan Indian Nations
Liberal
Gary Merasty Liberal Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK
Is it your fault that mothers who do not disclose the father of their child lose their status?
Okanese First Nation, Federation of Saskatchewan Indian Nations
Liberal
Gary Merasty Liberal Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK
Is it your fault that black mould is rampant in the homes of many of our reserves, perhaps even in yours? Is that your fault?
Liberal
Gary Merasty Liberal Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK
Is it your fault that you cannot pass laws on child welfare? You can pass laws on weed control, but not on child welfare. Is that your fault?