Evidence of meeting #29 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was status.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Shawn Atleo  National Chief, Assembly of First Nations
Jeannette Corbiere Lavell  President, Native Women's Association of Canada
Karen Green  Executive Director, Native Women's Association of Canada
Betty Ann Lavallée  National Chief, Congress of Aboriginal Peoples
Roger Hunka  National Bilateral Director, Congress of Aboriginal Peoples

11:50 a.m.

National Chief, Assembly of First Nations

Chief Shawn Atleo

Thank you.

I think the Aboriginal Healing Foundation needs to continue to be supported. Experts agree that it takes at least 10 years for the kinds of programs that are being implemented. I can speak from personal experience, from my own community on the west coast, that it takes at least 10 years to see some sort of significant results out of these programs. It's really important that the work continue, and it flows, I think, from the spirit of the apology offered by the Prime Minister.

On issues or approaches that have been spoken about in the past, we have an Indian affairs ministry. Perhaps what we need is a first nations-crown relations ministry. Perhaps we need, as I said earlier, a notion of a treaty commissioner. The Senate committee report on the implementation issues....

Again, committee, what we're suggesting here is that we take a look at the idea of high-level self-reflection on work that needs to be done in these areas, and that we consider jointly what kinds of resolutions there might be to address them.

11:50 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

Thank you, Mr. Bagnell.

Now we'll go to Mr. Dreeshen, who's new to our committee.

Mr. Dreeshen, welcome. You have three minutes for questions.

11:50 a.m.

Conservative

Earl Dreeshen Conservative Red Deer, AB

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I appreciate the opportunity to be here in the aboriginal affairs and northern development committee. I thank my fellow colleagues for the welcome they have given me.

Truly, I appreciate this opportunity. It's my first time to be able to speak to someone who has so much involvement in the future of our aboriginal people. I really do appreciate that.

I'm a school teacher, and in 1976 I had the honour to accompany some government members from the Alberta legislature to the 100th anniversary of the signing of Treaty No. 6. I picked up a little bumper sticker that day, and I proudly displayed that in my classroom. That was the one thing that I took out of my classroom 32 years later.

So I've had the opportunity to deal with a lot of aboriginal youth over my career. I've shared with them some of the joy and some of the anguish as well.

I know that your involvement in education has been extremely significant. Our government has committed $268 million over five years, and $75 million over the next two years, for programs such as the educational partnership program and the first nations student success program.

First, what tools does the Assembly of First Nations use to measure aboriginal student performance? Second, how has your organization received the introduction of these programs, and what role will they have in improving students' performance and educational environments for first nations communities?

11:55 a.m.

National Chief, Assembly of First Nations

Chief Shawn Atleo

Thank you for that.

I share in wanting to acknowledge Treaty No. 6. Even though my community is a non-treaty community on the west coast, the elders have quoted Treaty No. 6 all my life. To hear that you, after so many years in teaching, have obviously an awareness picks up on Mr. Duncan's comments about education.

In my role as chancellor, I do want to reach out to academia across the country and have them help answer the question about how we can graduate more people with an understanding about the original relationship between treaty nations, between first nations in this country and Canada more generally. I think that would go a long way toward closing gaps of misunderstanding and help develop the relationship.

That is work that needs to be done a broader basis. That speaks to curriculum. That speaks to the leadership of universities in training teachers to make sure they are going to support us and not just develop human capital for a market economy. They are responsible for developing actors in a civil society. We have deep social justice issues still in this country in all of the areas that we talk about.

We have a phenomenal education secretariat with the Assembly of First Nations, very professional. We have a national chiefs council on education. I couldn't speak to, but can get to you, the tools of analysis that we have.

One question I would want answered is whether or not those tools of analysis are done jointly. The point I'll keep reiterating here is this notion that we work from different data points, different information. It's not a shared analysis all of the time, and as such it becomes something that can cause conflict when the dire needs of our people and our communities remain so very high.

I hope that sheds some light on that. I would love to follow up with you on it, because I share an interest in examining it further.

11:55 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

Thank you, Chief.

Thank you, Mr. Dreeshen.

On behalf of all members of the committee, Chief, we greatly appreciate your time here. We issue, again, congratulations on your new role in a very important organization for aboriginal people, for first nations people across our country. I wish you all the best in the months ahead.

Members, we're going to suspend for approximately five minutes while we change over to our next witness. You can do your goodbyes, and we'll get under way as quickly as possible after that.

We'll suspend.

12:05 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

Members, we're going to continue now with our second hour of today's meeting.

We welcome the new president of the Native Women's Association of Canada, Jeannette Corbiere Lavell. We're pleased to have you here today. Congratulations on your new post, a very important post.

We are working through not quite a full 60 minutes for our session here today, so for the benefit of all members and Ms. Lavell, we're going to start with a 10-minute presentation. Then, members, we're going to shorten the rounds for questions in an effort to get in more questions. I am suggesting four minutes. Can you keep your rounds to four minutes?

We've scheduled 10 minutes for the opening presentation. If it goes over by a few minutes, that's okay. I will signal when you are getting to the end and you will need to wrap up at that point.

Welcome, Ms. Lavell.

October 6th, 2009 / 12:05 p.m.

Jeannette Corbiere Lavell President, Native Women's Association of Canada

Meegwetch.

[Witness speaks in her native language]

I bring you greetings from my people. I am from the Wikwemikong Unceded Indian Reserve situated on Manitoulin Island. I am Anishinabe from the Anishinabek Nation.

Many years ago I came before a committee such as this to retain my right as a member of my community, because, to me, this is who I am. It's my identity and my place, the place of all my ancestors and the place of any future generations that I'm part of.

I would like to share with you some of the teachings I have been brought up with and show you how I intend to use them as president of the Native Women's Association of Canada. Maybe some of you have heard of the grandfather teachings. These are practices that we try to follow every day.

The first is honesty, and through honesty, in my role as the president, I hope to be looking at transparency and accountability.

Humility. We're looking at our provincial and territorial member associations. They have been at the bottom rung, and we need to ensure that their voices are heard, so this is going to be one of my big initiatives.

Respect. Respect is inherent in all our relationships with each other. When we think of respect, we think of human rights and the matrimonial real property legislation that is being proposed, because this ensures that respect is being continued.

Under truth, we're looking at economic development, employment, education, training, especially for our women. The results will have a positive impact on our families and our communities.

Courage. It takes a lot of strength and courage to challenge legislation. We're looking at the Sharon McIvor case and our rights as citizens within our own nations.

Under love, love of our people, love of our community, love of our families, we're looking at the elimination of poverty, and all that this entails.

Wisdom. We look to the wisdom of our elders, the wisdom of our teachers, for health, well-being, and for a sense of balance within our communities.

So that's my view of how I'm going to approach my role as the president of Native Women's Association of Canada.

I would also like to acknowledge that we are here working and speaking to you on the lands of the Algonquin people, and I acknowledge them and recognize that it is a privilege to be here.

The Native Women's Association of Canada, for those of you who may not have been recently told about us, is a national representative organization made up of 11 provincial and territorial member associations, which we could refer to as PTMAs, from across the country. We are dedicated to improving the social, economic, medical, and political well-being of our first nations women, our Métis women, and the Inuit women of Canada. Many of our provincial organizations consist of members from those three categories.

At this committee session, I would like to present the priority issues that the Native Women's Association of Canada is considering, the issues that all of the aboriginal women in this country are looking to resolve. We're looking at the discriminatory provisions in the Indian Act, which we're still having to deal with. We're looking at matrimonial real property and violence against aboriginal women.

We will also speak about the need for greater capacity for the Native Women's Association of Canada to effectively carry out our critical work, particularly given the fact that NWAC is the only national organization representing the views of aboriginal women.

If we look at the Indian Act, in April 2009 the British Columbia Court of Appeal ruled in the McIvor case. I happen to know Sharon McIvor and I was supporting her in this initiative. The provisions they were looking at in the Indian Act were paragraphs 6(1)(a) and 6(1)(c), which governed registration or status. The ruling said that these were unconstitutional and must be amended within the year.

This is a consequence of the discriminatory second generation cut-off enacted in Bill C-31, which means that brothers and sisters may have different abilities to pass on status to their children. In particular, mothers who regain status through Bill C-31 will not be able to pass on this status to their grandchildren as easily as those who had prior to Bill C-31.

This particular section affects me directly. I regained my status under Bill C-31. For 15 years I didn't have my status, even though I'm very much a part of my community. Now under Bill C-31, two of my grandchildren have status according to the provisions; three of my granddaughters, whom I love dearly--these are my future generations--do not have status because of this provision within the Indian Act.

The McIvor decision is in part a welcome decision from the perspective of first nations women in Canada who have long fought for the removal of this discrimination resulting from Bill C-31. But it is not what we envisioned.

I took my own personal case to the Supreme Court of Canada--this was way back in 1970, so it's a long time ago--in my endeavour to remove sex discrimination contained in paragraph 12(1)(b) of the old Indian Act. I did it to protect my children and my grandchildren's rights.

Now here we are, almost 40 years later--I know because my son is 39--and we all know that Bill C-31 did not in fact result in equality in a meaningful way. This complicated system established under subsections 6(1) and 6(2) for status under the Indian Act has not only left residual discrimination toward the women's descendants--my granddaughters--but it will also lead to the eventual elimination of Indian status for many of our first nations. This is unfair, and we need to deal with it right away. I think this is an appropriate time to be addressing this.

I was also the commissioner on citizenship for the Anishinabek Nation, and during that work with my communities, the 42 first nations, I was told and I realized that within three years some of our first nations in the Anishinabek Nation will have their last status Indian born. After that, there will be no more status Indians in that community. That is in the middle of southern Ontario. That's reality. That's what we're facing under this current Indian Act.

There is also the unfair requirement for our women to state the paternity of their children. If they do not, their children's father is deemed to be non-status. This is totally unacceptable. I don't know if you would require your women to have to do that in order to keep their citizenship. There are many reasons for this within our communities, social and cultural reasons, and it definitely needs to be looked at.

We were told just last week in a presentation from Indian and Northern Affairs Canada that the federal government does plan to make the required amendments to ensure that the registration provisions comply with the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. We're pleased they have made that commitment. It is a step in the right direction. Earlier I mentioned that we support the B.C. Court of Appeals' decision in part, and that's because it is still too narrow. It is not dealing with my grandchildren and Sharon McIvor's grandchildren. This needs to be looked at. If we can do it in a meaningful way to ensure that the constitutional requirement to consult and accommodate our people's aboriginal and treaty rights is ensured, then I think we would be starting in the right direction.

In the Government of Canada's presentation to us last Friday, I believe, it outlined plans to hold national engagement sessions with national aboriginal organizations and 15 regional engagement sessions. This was done to provide information on the government's preferred approach to legislative amendment and to provide an opportunity to review and to receive views of all the aboriginal delegates they were talking to. But it was just an information session, and INAC has acknowledged that. If this is the approach that leads to the formulation of legislative change, you can be assured that the views and perspectives of our first nations community members will not have been solicited in this process in any kind of meaningful way.

NWAC urges this committee to call upon the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs to put adequate resources to hold meaningful discussions with the national aboriginal organizations and our communities across Canada about these legislative amendments. We urge you to ensure that the feedback received is considered in the drafting of these amendments. A culturally relevant gender-based analysis of the proposed amendments must take place. We would like some assurance that this is going to be done.

Once again, the unstated paternity presumption must also be addressed in a meaningful way. This is done to ensure that our women are not put through any more hardships. Once again, this is only dealing with our women within our communities, and it's just double hardships again. I know it's not a simple issue, and it goes to the essence of our rights as first nations, as nations within this country of Canada. We are nations, and we should have the right and be able to practise our rights as nations within this beautiful country of ours. All we would like to see is to have that right.

If we have that right to decide who our citizens are, who our members are, the right to our language, the right to our history, the right to practise our own ceremonies, I think that would be a step in the right direction. I believe it's the only way we can go.

12:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

Okay.

12:20 p.m.

President, Native Women's Association of Canada

Jeannette Corbiere Lavell

Matrimonial real property is another priority, and this is a big priority from both sides. It concerns the debate over what is going to happen in this piece of legislation. Aboriginal leaders have made their positions very clear about this proposed legislation. We have stated that it does not provide for the full and thoughtful consideration of this issue. We fully support legislative changes that will ensure protection for first nations individuals, especially our women within our communities and our reserves. However, we would not like to see this happen so that it endangers our rights as members within the community. We have that responsibility to protect our rights as aboriginal women within our communities, as first nation women, the right to protect our communities and our lands. This is why we have some concerns with the way the legislation is being proposed right now.

12:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

We're over time here.

12:20 p.m.

President, Native Women's Association of Canada

Jeannette Corbiere Lavell

We would like to know that we can have some support from the government to deal with Bill C-31 in a meaningful way, so that we can have the resources to work together on this. I don't believe it's very much to ask, as we are willing as a national organization to work with the government to deal with this particular section, which I know is causing a great deal of difficulty to many of the first nations across Canada.

12:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

Ms. Lavell, I think we're going to have to try to wrap up at that, so we can leave some time for questions. If you could sum up in the next 30 seconds or so, that would be great. If there's something still that you need to get out in the course of the meeting, you can probably have the opportunity to work that into your responses.

12:20 p.m.

President, Native Women's Association of Canada

Jeannette Corbiere Lavell

Meegwetch. I understand, and it's what always happens to me, but I get so caught up.

I just want to share the other big issue we have as aboriginal women, and I'm sure you've heard about it; we've just had our vigil. It's the violence that is being perpetuated against us as aboriginal women. I know there are some investigations taking place across Canada, and we would like to assure you that as native women's organizations, we are committed to working with the various systems within Justice to ensure that we can settle and make our communities a safe and viable place for our women and children. We have been working with the Minister of State on this, and I feel confident that we will be able to continue working on our special initiative, Sisters in Spirit--that's what our program is called.

Last, I want to say that as a national aboriginal women's organization we have been having much difficulty in trying to strengthen and bring up the leadership within our provincial and territorial organizations. We do not receive the same kind of funding as our brothers have within their organizations. It would be equitable, I believe, if we could be able to access some resources, some support from the various departments, to ensure that our voices are heard, not only on the violence towards women but also on the matrimonial real property, on the Sharon McIvor case. I would think it's just very simple.

So meegwetch. Thank you for listening.

12:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

Kitchi meegwetch. Thank you very much. Rest assured also that the brief you submitted will be translated and distributed to all members as well.

I would like to recognize Karen Green, Executive Director of the Native Women's Association of Canada.

Madame Green, welcome.

Now we'll go to the first round of questions, four minutes for both the question and response.

We'll begin with Mr. Russell, for four minutes.

12:20 p.m.

Liberal

Todd Russell Liberal Labrador, NL

Good afternoon, Ms. Corbiere Lavell and Ms. Green. It's good to have you here. And congratulations. I certainly do honour your life's work, which you're continuing in fine stride with your presentation here this afternoon.

I want to go back to the issue of murdered and missing aboriginal women. It's something that strikes me very personally, very emotionally. I tell you, I cannot believe that there are 520 documented murdered and missing aboriginal women in this country and we have not had a public inquiry or a public investigation into this. I am struck, and anybody in this room will be struck. The sexualized, racialized violence against aboriginal women exists every single day.

I just ask every committee member to reflect. You hear of an aboriginal woman missing, and the mother has to come to Ottawa and hold a press conference to try to get some attention--not once, but twice. A non-aboriginal woman goes missing, and the helicopters are out, the police cars are out, and there is a force on the ground like you've never seen. Something is wrong with this picture.

We say we've been addressing it, but it continues--for example, only two weeks ago, and another one last spring. Something has to happen.

I say this to my opposition colleagues, the Conservative Party. I am not saying this as a partisan, but I'm telling you to urge your party to move in the direction of raising this issue to national prominence. It's a scar on this country, and something has to be done. We have to have a national public inquiry into this, along with all the other supports that NWAC and others have asked for to continue concurrently. I don't believe we will ever erase this scar unless we expose it for what it is--the sexualized, racialized violence that it is.

I commend you for your work. I just wanted to make that statement. We will push for that public national investigation. It has to happen. Anything you can do to encourage us, to urge us on, would be appreciated.

12:25 p.m.

President, Native Women's Association of Canada

Jeannette Corbiere Lavell

Meegwetch.

Further, if we look at our women who are going through this, it also affects our families and our communities. Within our teachings, our children are a gift from the Creator. We have a responsibility to take care of them, to nurture them, and to prepare them for their roles. Taking one life is not acceptable. It's totally against our concept of who we are as a people. As well, this is our future generation. It's just devastating to our community.

I totally agree we need to stop this violence and all these murders. Many of our young women are going missing. We will work with any department. As you said, we would definitely support it.

12:25 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

You still have time for a very brief question, Mr. Russell.

12:25 p.m.

Liberal

Todd Russell Liberal Labrador, NL

No, I'm fine. Thank you.

12:25 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

Okay.

Mr. Lévesque, you have four minutes.

12:25 p.m.

Bloc

Yvon Lévesque Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Ms. Corbiere, congratulations on your election. It is my pleasure to welcome you here today.

With respect to the power of women within their community and governmental decisions, do you believe that Canada's recognition of the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples would help precipitate initiatives to meet the needs of first nations women?

12:25 p.m.

President, Native Women's Association of Canada

Jeannette Corbiere Lavell

As I understand the intent of the Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, that sense of equality is there and that sense of recognizing our traditional practices, which is respect for our women in any decision-making and any measures that affect us within our communities. In that context, I totally agree. It would be in our best interest to have that Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples recognized. It would be a step in the right direction.

I thank you for the question.

12:25 p.m.

Bloc

Yvon Lévesque Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Do you think that discussions between the Government of Canada and the first nations on Bill C-31, for instance, with a view to attaining equality in the country between the different nations, would also help to precipitate matters?

12:30 p.m.

President, Native Women's Association of Canada

Jeannette Corbiere Lavell

Exactly. You are absolutely correct. If we could have a meaningful consultation on Bill C-31, on our rights as women within the division of property, we would be able to share the cultural context. That is what is causing the problem right now. We see it as having some flaws in terms of taking away the rights of our community members. If we could have that meaningful dialogue and work with you on this, I think it would be good. That's how we must do it. It would be acceptable. Yes, that would be good.

12:30 p.m.

Bloc

Yvon Lévesque Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

It would be our pleasure. Thank you.

12:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton

Thank you, Monsieur Lévesque.

Now we'll go to Madame Crowder, for four minutes.