Evidence of meeting #5 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 40th Parliament, 3rd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was projects.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
John Duncan Conservative Vancouver Island North, BC
I'll ask another simple question that's probably not so simple.
If the Mackenzie Valley were in the Yukon, would the Yukon Environmental and Socio-economic Assessment Act have dealt with it?
Executive Director, Project Reviews, Operations, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency
Yes.
Conservative
John Duncan Conservative Vancouver Island North, BC
That's cool.
Does the NEB have a mandate in the Yukon at times?
Vice-Chair, National Energy Board
Yes, the NEB has its mandate with respect to oil and gas activities in the Yukon.
Executive Director, Project Reviews, Operations, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency
The NEB certainly has jurisdiction over the pipelines that would cross through international or interprovincial or inter-territorial boundaries.
Conservative
John Duncan Conservative Vancouver Island North, BC
My question was really about if it were internal to the Yukon.
Vice-Chair, National Energy Board
If it were internal to the Yukon, I don't believe so, because of devolution.
Conservative
John Duncan Conservative Vancouver Island North, BC
Given the long time the joint review panel took to report, obviously it wouldn't be done the same way now. Are there any suggestions for how that would be formatted to be different?
You're probably ill-suited to answer that question. Nothing has changed in terms of any statutory mandates or anything that would necessarily change that. It was a decision of the day, and it could be done differently in the future. Is that correct?
Executive Director, Project Reviews, Operations, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency
There's nothing today that changes how the assessment and the regulatory decisions on the MacKenzie gas project would be undertaken. My understanding is that the reference to substitution in the budget speech could apply to future projects, but not retroactively.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton
Thank you, Mr. Duncan.
We'll now go to the second round, with five minutes for questions and answers.
We'll begin with Mr. Martin. I understand you'll be splitting your time with Mr. MacAulay as well.
Liberal
Keith Martin Liberal Esquimalt—Juan de Fuca, BC
That's right, Chair.
Thank you, Ms. Leggett and Mr. Burgess, for being here today.
I'm going to pose a couple of questions and then Mr. MacAulay will pose his, and then we will listen.
You may not be able to answer this question, but if you could get back to the committee on this, I'd be grateful.
First, there are quite a number of pediatric cancers and congenital deformities in the first nations communities living around the tar sands. If possible, could you please release to the committee any environmental impact studies of the tar sands on human health and any subsequent studies that have been done to assess the impact of the tar sands on—
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton
Mr. Martin, I'm going to have to stop you there. It's probably a very appropriate question in a different committee, but our orders of the day are to address barriers to and solutions for northern economic development. So unless you can tie that in with some relevance, it really is a non-topic.
Liberal
Keith Martin Liberal Esquimalt—Juan de Fuca, BC
Certainly, Chair. The relevance, of course, is that if you have sick people you don't get economic development. That's the reason. If you're sick, you can't go to work.
If you do have those studies, then I'd be grateful if you could release them.
My other question is that if a development project is taking place in a first nations community, what trumps what, the CEA or the environmental assessment done on the first nations community?
My colleague Mr. MacAulay also has a question.
Thank you.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
Thank you very much.
I'm new to the committee, but welcome here.
Ms. Leggett, you were talking about your modified workings in the north. I expect you did that in order to involve more people in the local areas. Is that correct? You talked about how you modified the process. I'd like you to elaborate on that. I expect I know the answer, but....
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton
Sure, go ahead.
If that's your only question, Mr. MacAulay, why don't we get a quick answer for that one? Then, with the time remaining, perhaps we'll come back to Mr. Martin's question.
Vice-Chair, National Energy Board
Thank you very much.
Are you referring to the comments I made about learning from northerners about our processes?
Vice-Chair, National Energy Board
I spoke about our enhanced engagement with aboriginals, as well as with other stakeholders. You are correct that the board has increasingly recognized how important it is that local parties know of the National Energy Board and what our mandate is.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
You mentioned how intimidating it was at one time, and I think that's what you were trying to explain--that it wasn't intimidating to the people who were involved.
Vice-Chair, National Energy Board
We've had that feedback from a number of hearings--not northern hearings, because we took a very different approach, but in southern Canada. I was referring to the learning we've had from working up north, where we've learned that we need to listen, and then we need to listen some more, and then we need to listen some more, and then we need to share ideas, and then we need to start talking ourselves.
We're not looking to develop solutions in the south and impose them in the north, because we know it's a different place. We've learned lessons from our hearings in the south with respect to parties; we have taken those same lessons and applied them.
When I talked about making our hearing processes less intimidating, that includes things as easy as having a this type of layout in the room, as opposed to having the panel up on a dais and far away from people. We also make sure we accommodate aboriginal groups and listen to their oral testimony, because we know that their traditions are not in writing and that their testimony is in oral form. Those types of aspects are what I was referring to.
In order to do that, we need to get out to the communities earlier, because they need to understand what our processes are in advance, as well as what they need to do to get their viewpoints across to us effectively on a proposed project. We've learned that a lot of people, parties who may not be sophisticated in some cases, will say by the end of the hearing, “If I'd known what this was going to be like at the front end, I would have been able to better prepare”. We're learning that lesson and making sure we take the time to get out at the front end, so that when the hearing does come to a particular area, people are feeling well prepared and are able to give their evidence.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton
We are out of time. On Mr. Martin's question, as it pertains to our study, if you are able to format a response on that and take a look at the debate when we're done, it would be most appreciated.
Now let's go to Mr. Rickford, the member for Kenora.
Conservative
Greg Rickford Conservative Kenora, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to the witnesses.
I am the member of Parliament for the great Kenora riding, so I'm happy to be involved in this discussion. I'm sorry, Todd, but it was high time that came out.
I want to bring to the discussion the McCrank report, which I hope you folks are aware of or have some appreciation or knowledge of. Is that okay?