Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on March 24th, 2011

[Margaret Melhorn]

On devolution, as I indicated in my statement, our governments, the Government of Canada, and several aboriginal governments signed the agreement in principle in January. It will set the stage for negotiating a final agreement on devolution. Following that, federal legislation will make the necessary changes to the Northwest Territories Act to enact that change.

This is a very important step toward further development of the Northwest Territories economically, politically, and fiscally. It will give us the last major province-like authority that is critical for Northwest Territories residents to have the tools to take control of the development and management of lands and resources in the Northwest Territories. It will also provide a net fiscal benefit to the Northwest Territories from the royalties that are generated in the territories.

[Greg Rickford, Conservative, Kenora, ON]

Thank you.

Did a formal consultation process take place with the member and anybody in the department? Are you aware of formal meetings, for example, with the ministers or the premier himself on this matter?

[Margaret Melhorn]

I believe there were meetings. I'm not sure exactly when they took place with respect to--

[Greg Rickford, Conservative, Kenora, ON]

You weren't involved in any.

[Margaret Melhorn]

No.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Thank you very much, Mr. Rickford.

We accommodated Mr. Bevington on that first round so he could get a question in. He's also a witness here for us today, so we thank him for joining us here as a witness and coming back a second time.

If you like, members, we can have another round of seven minutes. That will give members the opportunity to put additional questions. I know that's a little bit different and unusual, but such is the case for what could be the last full day of our parliamentary session.

Mr. Bevington, I welcome you to join the witness table at this point.

We'll go to Mr. Bagnell for the first question.

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

Thank you.

For the GNWT, would it be fair to say that this is a sensitive issue, in the sense that your politicians wouldn't want to bite the hand that feeds them? If they're in negotiations with a government that may not feel that such a provision is appropriate, you have to be sort of diplomatic in positioning a bill like this.

[Margaret Melhorn]

Neither our cabinet nor our legislative assembly has taken a position on this bill. Beyond that, I can't speak to the political....

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

So neither the cabinet nor the legislature has taken a position on this bill.

[Margaret Melhorn]

Correct.

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

That's good to know.

In your opening remarks you suggested that your preference would be to have no limit at all. You have an agreement in principle with the federal government on devolution. Once that's finished it will transfer virtually all the substantive residual provincial powers to the GNWT. For most intents and purposes, you will have very similar powers to the major powers of a province. Is that true?

[Margaret Melhorn]

That's true.

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

Does it not seem an anomaly or paternalistic that the federal government would want to keep this one item of what seems like excessive control of a borrowing limit when it doesn't force that on any of the other 13 jurisdictions in Canada, other than the other two territories?

[Margaret Melhorn]

I think I used the term “anomaly” in my statement.

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

You used the word “anomaly”.

[Margaret Melhorn]

Yes.

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

Okay.

With the revenues you talked about in that devolution agreement that Mr. Rickford brought up, you mentioned the increasing revenues that would bring to you, which then would also give you even more resources to pay the interest on such debt over and above the increasing revenues that the debt would bring in because it's increasing infrastructure that would then be access to more resources.

[Margaret Melhorn]

There would be a net fiscal benefit associated with that devolution. It would increase our revenues, yes.

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

Mr. Bevington, before you embarked on this venture, did you discuss it with politicians in the GNWT?

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

Before I brought this bill forward for consideration by the House, I certainly did. Before I brought it forward for first reading...well, private member's bills are—

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

I'm sorry, let me rephrase the question. Up to today, have you had discussions with GNWT politicians on this bill?

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

Absolutely, I have, on an ongoing basis.

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

What did they say?

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

Here's a response in Hansard from the finance minister:

The Member of Parliament is elected by the people of the Northwest Territories in a general election. He doesn't answer to this Assembly, he answers to the people of the Northwest Territories.

This is the Minister of Finance in our government:

He has tools at his disposal to advance causes that he sees as important to the development of the Northwest Territories, some that we share in common with him. The Member of Parliament had the good grace to contact us, to consult with us, to indicate to us what he was doing, ask for our feedback and our thoughts, which we gave him. But it should be very clear in this House, he doesn't answer to us, we don't answer to him, and he's doing what he thinks is necessary as a Member of Parliament.

That is the Minister of Finance of our government speaking on November 4, 2010.

Yes, of course, I have. In terms of formal consultation, I live in the north and I consult with people in my way. I'm a politician. I reserve the right to consult with people in my way. I consult with people at every election as well, and I represent all the people in the Northwest Territories. For anyone to doubt that is to doubt our basic democratic principles in this country.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

You still have a couple of minutes.