Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Nov. 30th, 2011

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, St. Paul's, ON]

Your government voted in favour of the Liberal motion two weeks ago. In order to fulfill the obligation under that motion passed by the Parliament of Canada, can we expect to see some money in the budget to actually realize it so that 100% of first nations homes will have safe running and drinking water and waste water management?

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Yes, and that's why we supported the motion. We have been spending with that exact objective, and we--

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, St. Paul's, ON]

No, no, this is the future we're talking about.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

--have a two-year commitment that extends into next year.

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, St. Paul's, ON]

At the same level?

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Yes. We are in a time of concern about expenses, but we have a way of setting priorities, and water and waste water are priority items for the government.

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, St. Paul's, ON]

So the housing--

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris Warkentin]

Colleagues, I have to interject here. I do apologize, Ms. Bennett. We'll stop the clock.

We do have bells ringing. I need all-member consent to continue sitting as a committee until 4:25, I'm thinking, which will still give us some opportunities to ask questions and give us time to get back to the House.

Is there all-member consent to do that?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris Warkentin]

There is full consent.

Ms. Bennett, we'll return to your question.

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, St. Paul's, ON]

Thank you.

With regard to the assessment you did on water, was there an equal assessment done on the housing need? I understand from your department that you think there are about 25,000 homes that are required, yet the AFN says it's probably 85,000.

Do you have a report telling you the housing needs? Again, there doesn't seem to be any money in the estimates for housing.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

We have data, but we don't have it to the same level as the water assessment. I think we looked at 98% of all residences or public buildings, in terms of their water and waste water. It was a very comprehensive survey.

So, no, we don't have it to that level. We make capital plans, and the capital plans are done regionally and nationally to set priorities.

I understand your position is that you would continue to throw money until such time as everything is taken care of, but it just doesn't work that way.

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, St. Paul's, ON]

I think that's what Kelowna was about, that there had to be an accountability piece, plus health, education, housing, and economic development. I think the Kelowna accord was very clear about the interactivity of those things—with $5 billion, though, as well.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

You can do the math. I just finished saying that we've spent $2.5 billion just on water and waste water. If you look at what we did on housing and other infrastructure, I'll take no back seat to whatever—

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, St. Paul's, ON]

We're looking at tents with children in them and winter coming.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

—you have to say about your plans that were never implemented.

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris Warkentin]

Thank you very much.

Thanks, Ms. Bennett.

Mr. Clarke, for seven minutes.

[Rob Clarke, Conservative, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I thank the Minister for coming.

I get amused when I hear the Kelowna accord as the last-ditch effort to try to make it right. It's kind of a joke, because when I was in the House of Commons, I asked for a copy of the Kelowna accord from one of your colleagues and she couldn't even produce it. So it's quite insulting to hear from a Liberal: when they could have tabled it, they failed to do so.

I look at the current funding, which is $10.2 billion for first nations and aboriginals, to try to meet some of these issues. Back in 2005, I believe it was at $5.4 billion. I remember sitting on the health committee and listening to the department talk about additional funding just for health care, and the whole program with the Kelowna accord was only an additional $5 million. So slap me on the head, I don't know what else to say. As a first nation, I should be insulted whenever they mention the Kelowna accord.

Anyhow, I have vented here enough, and I apologize, Minister. It's just that the Kelowna accord was a false promise, a hollow promise, and it irks me when I hear about it.

I'm curious about the residential schools. My grandmother and grandfather attended the residential schools in Duck Lake, and I've seen some of the hardships of the residential school survivors. I have to say my grandmother and grandfather actually benefited from residential schools, to the point that when there was a cash payout, they didn't spend a cent of it but it remained in her bank account until the day she died.

With regard to the residential school settlement agreement, can you please update the committee?

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Yes, I can.

Before I do that, you had a segue about spending. We had a surge of $1.4 billion from the economic action plan that went to first nations, and some of that was leveraged with provincial money. It was over and above the normal capital spending by the department, so this made a real difference in a lot of places. This is one of the reasons why one of the local chiefs in my area said we had accomplished more in three years than the Liberals had in 13 years in terms of aboriginal affairs.

As to the residential school settlement agreement, in September we passed the deadline for applications for the common experience payment. At that date, 97% of the 80,000 originally estimated claimants had been paid. That's a pretty good track record. There was a lot of public information, a lot of advertising, to make sure that people got the message that the program was ending.

We will continue to process applications until September 19, 2012, so it's not as if the door has closed. This would be in cases of disability, undue hardship, or exceptional circumstances, so it's a subjective decision. In respect to the independent assessment process, 21,000 applications have been admitted and 12,400 claims have been resolved. We expect the current application forecast to reach 30,000 by the deadline of September 19, 2012.

[Rob Clarke, Conservative, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

I'm curious about the independent assessment process and the number of applications that came through, if I could just get more clarification on those numbers.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

The numbers are more than we predicted or forecast. The award per claim is also more than we forecast, so this is an expensive process. But it really isn't about the money. We reached an Indian residential schools settlement because it was the right thing to do. It's all about reconciliation. It has had profound emotional consequences for many families, that I've been personally aware of, including families who didn't know what had gone on with their own siblings. It had been hidden, and it all came out after the Prime Minister's apology. The fact that this is arm's length, court approved, court supervised, and court adjudicated, I think is fantastic. It's absolutely been the right thing to do, and it's a proud moment, I believe, for our government that we made this happen.

[Rob Clarke, Conservative, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

On that note, could I get some insight on some stained glass that's possibly being installed...?

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Because we're 308 members of Parliament who are very used to our surroundings, we forget what special real estate we're occupying. The Centre Block is an extraordinary structure. If you stand in the foyer of the House of Commons, where all the scrums are, and you look straight ahead, there are three windows over the entrance door. That's a south-facing wall. There are always lots of light on that wall. We have the Speaker's permission to utilize that middle window to commemorate the residential school survivors, the Inuit, Métis, and first nations. We're going to set up an advisory panel, and they're going to commission an aboriginal artist to create that stained glass window, with the full expectation that the project will be finished in 2012. That's a legacy that will always be there.

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris Warkentin]

Thank you, Minister.

Your time is up, Mr. Clarke.

Colleagues, we will now suspend this meeting until—

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Mr. Chair, on a point of order before we suspend, can I please request that the officials come back? I believe we'll be finished voting in plenty of time for the officials to return.