Evidence of meeting #119 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was home.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC
Are there any that you're aware of that have been happening?
Conseil de la nation Atikamekw
I know there are meetings here and there. They're trying to work on governance right now with the organization there in Quebec, but it's on the federal level. I know Quebec was an observer there. Personally, I cannot answer that question.
Conservative
Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC
From everything that we have been hearing—whether it's something like traditional foods or whether it's more complex, such as long-term care and the regulations that you're required to meet that are sometimes a challenge in rural and remote communities—it sounds as though those tripartite discussions will be essential to resolving the issues. Would that be accurate?
Conseil de la nation Atikamekw
I think it's a great example right now of the complexity of relations between the first nations communities, the provincial level and the federal level. We are always bouncing from one to the other. At the same time, with the lack of resources in our community, I think there's a little confusion that always comes with our administration system.
One example there is the provincial rule on “health food” and the criteria that were fixed by the federal government. You understand what I mean. There's a bit of confusion that can get in place there in our communities with the administrative people. We always have to be careful in that matter. As I said earlier, I think there should be a big meeting between both levels of government to make sure they harmonize everything for the future onwards, so we don't feel like we're bouncing from one to the other.
Conservative
Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC
You talked about the adaptation of homes for someone who has increasing challenges with disability, whether it's ramps or bathrooms. Are there no special programs available for communities to apply to, in terms of doing housing adaptation for band members who have new challenges?
Conseil de la nation Atikamekw
The problem is, again, the resources. All the money allowed for building new facilities is always for new houses in the communities. There's a long list of people who need houses, so all the resources are put into that.
Of course, some people, anticipating that in the future they're going to have problems with their house, ask for a little help from the band. Sometimes when the human resource people who build houses in the community have the time for it, and if they have the money and the resources, then sometimes I've seen that happen. When my grandma and grandpa were still able to live in their house, they put in stuff to facilitate things with the bath and so on, and a ramp to help them to get up easier, but the ultimate goal was for them to move eventually into elder houses.
You understand the story and what happened after. My grandma is still there, but my grandpa had to get out, and somebody had to take care of him.
Liberal
NDP
Rachel Blaney NDP North Island—Powell River, BC
Thank you to all of you for being here with us today. I'm going to start with you, Grand Chief.
First of all, I'm sorry to hear about the loss of your grandfather, and I assume that your story, sadly, is not unique. Could you share with us a little bit about what happens with your community when they can no longer be in those homes? Do families usually take people in? Are they having to go out into a larger community? How long is the wait-list, usually? How far away are they going? You talked about the high level of the first language in your community. Is that a huge barrier when they have to leave home and live in a care home?
Conseil de la nation Atikamekw
I'm going to answer the last question.
Yes, it's a big barrier. We ask to have more resources in that direction. Every person who has to leave the community and go into a hospital in a town preferably should have someone to help them with translation and to follow in their steps when they go travelling and go to restaurants and everything. They need someone in order to feel more comfortable and to make sure that the doctor and other people who intervene in it really understand what that sick person is saying. In general, it's all related to....
Atikamekw Nation is very particular. Our language is very strong. Our culture is very strong. We're isolated. Between 70% and 75% still live in the community, compared to all the rest of Canada, where it is the opposite: only 30% still live in the community, and in some communities it's lower than that.
When you were talking about a pilot project, I think the Atikamekw nation is a perfect nation to create that pilot project. If you guys have a project, I'll be open to discussing it.
NDP
Rachel Blaney NDP North Island—Powell River, BC
You speak of feeling like you're stuck between the tree and the bark, and of the challenge. I hear about the amount of report writing and I think about the jurisdictional challenges too. Not only are you having to write many reports, but you're also going between provincial and federal jurisdictions. You have that challenge.
One of the things that's come up in this study a couple of times is that we need to look at Jordan's principle and broaden the scope of it. Could you talk a little about how how you think about that?
Conseil de la nation Atikamekw
First of all, I am the Grand Chief and I know a lot of things that are going on in our community, but we have specialists who can answer you better than I can in those matters. Sadly, though, we were convoked here pretty much at the last minute, so we didn't have time to have a good, deep conversation. Ms. McLeod was talking about maybe identifying each matter and going deeper into each matter, but we didn't have the time for that.
Yes, as I said, it's a big issue in our community, and it's hard for us to always make up the difference in between. As soon as you come out of the community, you're supposed to be receiving the services from the province. That's how it is, but within the community there are not enough services, and we can't afford to go out of our community all the time.
We are so behind right now, and we ask for a lot of stuff. I feel like I'm always begging for something—we need this, we need that—and it's not a good feeling for us. It's not a good feeling as a leader to always be asking. We need more, and it's evident. In one of the communities, we need 200 houses to house everybody. It's a big issue, but we have to start somewhere, and I think it's by believing. Everybody here has to believe in us and give us more flexibility and more autonomy with respect to how we do our business in our community.
This is the way to rebuild pride among our people. If they are proud, then they're going to go further. They're going to go study and they're going to be proud of themselves. They're going to take better care of each other. That's how we build a society: We have to start at the base, and then from there we'll go higher and higher.
We are about 60 to 70 years behind in terms of socio-economic development. How are we going to solve this problem? Here we have a lot of very smart people around this table, and I'm sure we can find something good for our future. Like I said, whenever I go to speak to different organizations or when I do a conference or whatever, I always say that we don't want to be a burden any more. We want to be able to contribute to the emergence of the society. We want to be able to feel good. We want to be able to have a sense of belonging to the society so we can also contribute to the protection of this land, the protection of the country.
There's no contradiction to be sovereign within the state here. That's one thing we have to understand, but everybody has to have the same message. We have to work together to better our society. We don't want to give future generations problems. That's what I always say to everybody that we have to work together.
For example, I said to my friend, “One day, if something happens here, you know my people will always be here to defend the land, and we'll defend everybody who's on it. No matter what colour they are, we're going to defend them.” That's one thing. We always cheer too when the Canadian hockey team wins the gold medal. We are proud of that too. We can have a sense of belonging, but there's a lot work that needs to be done.
A lot of people are still bitter about the residential schools, about the assimilation program and stuff like that. It didn't work in the end. Maybe they did not have bad intentions and maybe they really thought they were going to help, but we all know the result. In the end, it didn't help; it just created more problems and more bitterness. Now we've created a barrier, but we have to break this barrier. We have to work together to make a better future for your youth and for our youth. Working together, we can have this great society to live in, to be stronger in, and to be proud to defend. That's how I see it.
Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, Lib.
It is refreshing to see that you can speak English and French just as well.
According to the Department of Indigenous Services, $19.5 million will be going to palliative care over five years.
How much improvement could the announced funds make to long-term care services in your community? What would be your recommendations on distributing those funds? What are the Atikamekw nation's needs when it comes to long-term care centres?
Conseil de la nation Atikamekw
As I said earlier, there are currently no facilities where we can provide long-term care. We don't have the skills or human resources to provide the necessary services.
Although, in the short term, we can invite professionals from outside our community to settle among us to provide the necessary services, we will still have this problem: a lack of homes to accommodate them. It is a vicious cycle.
To answer your question partially, Ms. Blaney, I must say that there has indeed been more money since Jordan's principle was adopted. However, we still have a problem with infrastructure.
We are talking about human beings. When you want to help a human being improve, you take an interest in their personality, their identity, their character; you try to strengthen their pride and self-confidence. The same applies to a community. Yes, there is some money, but the improvement of facilities has been forgotten. Our communities don't really have the equipment and infrastructure needed to accommodate all those people.
We are working on developing our vision and our plans. We are moving forward by celebrating every small victory, but when we are behind by 60 or 70 years, those victories sometimes don't seem like much. We will never catch up completely. I have already brought this situation up to a minister, and he told me that we would move forward one project at a time. I told him that we could not even allow ourselves to advance one project at a time; we had to advance 10 projects at a time, since we are so behind in all areas. Huge investments are needed, especially in infrastructure. That is the main issue, since everything stems from it.
Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, Lib.
What could the federal government do to coordinate its funding process with that of the provinces better?
We know that this is an issue. Requests have been made at the provincial level. This does not fall under federal jurisdiction, but we are also there to contribute to the effort. This really falls under provincial jurisdiction. How are you managing to align all this?
Conseil de la nation Atikamekw
An example of an issue we often face is needing to build a palliative care hospice in the community. It is certain that the majority of people want to die at home, surrounded by their family, but homes are often full. Logically speaking, it would be better to create a place for palliative care. But the establishment needs to be built, equipment needs to be bought and skilled people need to be found to provide the services. In addition, accreditation from the province is needed. That is another source of the problem. We need better collaboration and better communication between the two levels of government. Even if the federal government is providing all the resources, there must still be some flexibility on the provincial side. We have a lot of training to provide in our communities.
Over the initial years of our project, there will unavoidably be some gaps in that area. The province must have a better understanding. To achieve that, the federal government must provide support.
Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, Lib.
What kind of support must be provided to first nations communities, and more specifically to your community, to ensure they are able to develop and provide health services that integrate healing knowledge and practices and aboriginal medicine?
Conseil de la nation Atikamekw
It is a matter of providing programs that will recognize those types of practices. We in the Atikamekw nation are very close to our culture. We have a lot of people who, even today, are using traditional plants to heal certain diseases. I have seen some incredible healing.
At the same time, people are stigmatizing our knowledge. Yes, we are very close to our culture, but we are stigmatized, in a way. As we don't want to be criticized, we don't talk about it or we simply abandon those practices, to avoid being told that we are barbarians or something like that.
Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, Lib.
Very good.
Thank you for your answers, Grand Chief.
I will now turn to Julie Harvey.
In light of discussions and considering the particularities of your community, what would be your recommendations to ensure the provision of quality long-term care on reserve? What could the government do to help you?
Director, Seniors' Health, Pekuakamiulnuatsh Takuhikan
Thank you for your question.
I would like to begin by repeating a recommendation made by Ms. Larouche earlier. It was about having adequate funding to enable us to provide home care and accommodations to our elders who must remain in the community, regardless of the level of care required. The goal is to be able to provide services from the outset, as soon as the individual ages and begins to lose autonomy. Those individuals may need assistance with housework, for example. We really need to be able start providing services from the outset until end of life.
Unfortunately, we are noting that services provided are lacking, especially when our elders must leave the community to seek out services when their health deteriorates and the intensity of care increases. We really want to be able to provide a continuum of services from the moment when people begin to experience a slight loss of autonomy until the palliative care stage.
Our main need is to obtain funding that would enable us to provide those services, to train our staff, to hire employees in sufficient numbers and to take care of our infrastructure.
