Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on June 4th, 2019

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

I don't think there's any question that we have a lot of work to do. I think some of those recommendations overlap with actions that our government is currently taking, so we have to read the report methodically.

We accept the recommendations in the report in their entirety, and now we have to decide what that national action plan will be. That will require a lot of vigorous work, I think, not only on the part of Minister Bennett's department and my department, but all departments, for the most part.

As you well know, I've said here before committee that every minister has in his or her mandate letter a commitment to reconciliation, and it is something that is going to require the efforts of the government.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

I'm going to move on to the boil water advisories.

As you know, I don't share the government's enthusiasm about this. You're not going to meet your quotas. I'm going to give you some examples.

I know that you're touting the 85 long-term drinking water advisories that have been lifted, but I have met with so many indigenous groups and I'll give you one example: Slate Falls First Nation in northwestern Ontario. They had all 11 long-term boil water advisories—drinking water—lifted last year, in March 2018. I see that some of your staff know where I'm going on this. They got a new water treatment plant. Seventeen days later, it was back under a drinking water advisory. Today, Slate Falls is under a drinking water advisory, and it has been since August 29.

I can tell you that there are dozens of bands in this nation that are going through this problem—

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Yes.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

—and you keep saying, well, we've removed the long term, but we still have the short term, and we're not going to tell you what the long term is or what the short term is.

There is still a crisis, so don't tell me that we're going to reach this in 2021—because we will not reach it—but I would like to know what your department is going to do. I laugh when I see these reports come out, because I know they're not true. I can go to Slate, and I can give you a list if you want, but where are we going on this? You're not training band members properly. We can give them all the new equipment, but then we leave the reserve and then—in this case, 17 days later—they're back on.

What are we doing to rectify this when we leave the situation and leave them in charge of the water treatment plant? I think that's one of the issues that we need to address with your department.

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Thank you, Mr. Waugh, for your hope and optimism.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

Yes. The glass is half-empty.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Of drinking water, yes.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

Pardon the pun.

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

No, no. We are on track to make this happen. We're doubling down on our efforts.

I'll let Paul take the floor to give you some quick figures.

I've also been to, for instance, Piapot nation in northern Saskatchewan and Piapot had theirs burn down. We have a new temporary one that is up and running, with staff who are tremendously proud of the amount of training they've gone through and that they are able to provide the fixes that are needed to make sure that community.... I think there might be a notion that many of these communities are close together. Some of them, as you well know, out your way—it was an eye-opener for me—are quite spread out, so there's quite a bit of work involved.

At Piapot, they are very proud of the fact that they have that training on the ground. I then turned to this position, this belief—having seen it in other places—that you cannot simply build these things and walk away. If they are going to work, then you have to have people trained and on the ground and ready to make the fixes as they are needed. Also, a team of people provides meaningful employment.

The only way you're going to solve it on an ongoing basis is to make sure that there is training provided on the ground. That is already happening, and that was the commitment of the department.

Paul has some numbers.

You read them out, Paul.

[Paul Thoppil, Chief Finances, Results and Delivery Officer, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Thank you.

Mr. Waugh, you're totally correct. It's not about simply putting in water treatment plants or systems where communities don't have access, but it's also about ensuring that for those who do, they don't go, ever, into a situation of long-term boil water advisories or even short-term ones. That's why, in budget 2019, there is an amount in front of you of $739 million; it's for doubling down, to make sure that those who may be bubbling below long term are rectified and there is money for training and recruitment of staff, to ensure that those communities don't go into the situation that you just described.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

The Sahhaltkum Indian Reserve 4 in B.C., has had dangerous levels of manganese in their water, which has made the water turn brown. This is one of the issues that we have. We've seen this. What are you doing to address the band-aid solutions that we've seen in some of these areas?

[Jean-François Tremblay]

There are more than thousands of them, so, of course, it's a complex issue and each of them needs a specific approach, and that's what we're doing. We identified the ones who are at risk. Our approach is getting more and more sophisticated. At the beginning, everybody focused on the ones who are long term. Now we are focused on the ones who are at risk and we're focusing on training people and finding permanent solutions. Sometimes we come with a temporary solution and work on the long term after that.

Of course, it's a difficult task, given the size of the inventory, but if you look at the numbers, they're going in the right direction and we're still optimistic that we will meet our commitment on this.

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

You're right to point out that it's a big challenge; it's huge.

[The Chair, Liberal, MaryAnn Mihychuk]

We're now moving to MPs Ashton and Jolibois.

I understand they're sharing their time.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Thank you.

Minister O'Regan, would you agree that there is a housing crisis on first nations across this country?

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Yes.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Excellent. Why is your government not doing anything to address that?

In the 2017 budget, you made a commitment of $600 million over three years and repeatedly we've heard from leaders, we've heard from advocates, that that is wholly inadequate and amounts to anywhere from one to 11 new homes per community, depending on their geographic location.

First nations in my riding, including communities like Cross Lake, a community of 8,000 people, have hundreds of people on the housing waiting list. There are communities in my riding where there are anywhere from 20 to 25 people in a home. We know that 50% of homes have mould in them, which leads to health issues, social issues, and truly it makes up what is known as a national crisis.

Your government has talked a good talk on reconciliation, on investment in infrastructure, but when it comes to housing, your government has failed.

I'm wondering what you can say to that, given that this is a very serious situation and truly a crisis that requires urgent action and should have required it years ago.

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Thank you for the question, Ms. Ashton, and I would simply say that how you've characterized this is wholly untrue.

We have certainly done quite a bit. We came into government with 86,000 houses, that was our shortage. We have built or repaired 14,000 so far. That is not nothing; it is certainly not nothing to the people who live in those houses. Do we need to do better? Yes. Are we going as fast as we possibly can, given capacity issues? Yes.

It's $600 million over three years to first nations, so far—$600 million; $500 million, over 10 years, for Métis nation housing; $400 million over 10 years for Inuit-led housing. It's the largest investment in housing, I would venture to say, in federal government history. It will be ongoing.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Minister, I appreciate that—

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

I don't know if you do, though. Those are big numbers.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

—but reading the numbers, dramatically.... And when I've told you $600 million, so it's not wholly untrue. Let me tell you, having spent time in the first nations I represent, and hearing from people directly, I am conveying to you the message that they give me, so I don't appreciate my assessment being characterized as wholly untrue.

I refer to the $600 million figure, and if you do the math, that equates to one to 11 new homes per community, communities that have hundreds of people on the waiting list.

My question isn't asking you to repeat the numbers you've committed to. It's asking you, as minister, as the head of the department, as you've understood it's a crisis, what exactly are you planning to do to address the actual crisis, not just repeating numbers that I've said are inadequate in dealing with what's going on on the ground?

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

We will continue to build houses as fast as we can in partnership with nations, in partnership with Inuit and in partnership with Métis. We work with them on the ground to determine their needs. It was only, I think, last week that I was in Whitedog and walking through homes where there were five families in a three-bedroom house with the living room converted into another bedroom and two newborns less than one month old. There is no question that we have a significant challenge ahead of us.

We have increased our efforts at a level that the federal government has never seen. We will keep hard at it until we have provided adequate housing and proper housing to everyone who needs it.

[Georgina Jolibois, NDP, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

Minister O'Regan, you will remember earlier this year when you were in La Ronge and you took a moment with me to stop and reflect at the memorial for missing and murdered indigenous women. One of the women is still missing, and her name is Happy Charles. I met with the family, and her family is still holding out hope that she will be found, but it's clear to me that they still need support. They need support in finding justice for Happy, and they need support in dealing with the trauma they have experienced and continue to go through. In your role as minister, what are you doing to help families like Happy Charles' and all the northern communities that continue to be forgotten by this government?

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

We've done, I think, significant work in providing shelter and women's shelters on reserve across the country. We need to step up those efforts. I think we need to make sure that we never have situations again where indigenous women who are fleeing a bad place, an abusive house or—