Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on June 9th, 2016

[Dr. Cindy Blackstock]

First, I would like to see this Parliament decide that we're no longer going to racially discriminate against children as a fiscal policy. You stop doing it. You stop deepening that whole disadvantage that affects all areas of our children's experience. Second, you start addressing and creating a Marshall Plan to address the shortfalls that have accumulated over these last 148 years.

If you stop the racial discrimination starting today, that would be the greatest gift for Canada's 150th birthday. As a nation, we're better than racial discrimination against kids. Making this change would bring us into alignment with those values that Canadian sing about when they say they stand on guard.

[David Yurdiga, Conservative, Fort McMurray—Cold Lake, AB]

Okay, thank you.

How much time do I have left?

[The Chair, Liberal, Andy Fillmore]

That's it. Thank you.

[David Yurdiga, Conservative, Fort McMurray—Cold Lake, AB]

Really?

[The Chair, Liberal, Andy Fillmore]

Well, four seconds.

Mr. Michael McLeod.

[Michael McLeod, Liberal, Northwest Territories, NT]

Thank you for coming to present to us some very shocking statistics, and thank you to our grand chief from the Northwest Territories for joining us. We appreciate seeing him here.

I'm looking at the numbers you've put out on what's needed to address some of the issues for the children, as well as the $260 million you said we should be looking at, and I'm wondering how broadly all this is spread. Does it cover all aboriginal indigenous populations, or are we just talking about the first nations? You're not including the Métis and the Inuit in this, are you?

[Dr. Cindy Blackstock]

No, I was speaking with regard to the immediate relief measures arising out of the Canadian Human Rights Tribunal, which only affects first nations children. Specifically, I was referring to the provision of child and family services, and Jordan's principle.. That doesn't even cover the child welfare needed for first nations children.

[Michael McLeod, Liberal, Northwest Territories, NT]

You carved out an area for B.C., but have you looked at what's happening in the Northwest Territories? You have first nations, and a lot of what's in the budget is identified for reserves. We don't have reserves in the Northwest Territories. We have aboriginal people who live in communities. Are you taking these differences into consideration?

[Dr. Cindy Blackstock]

The program for INAC's provision of child and family services does not apply to the territories. I had the honour of being on an advisory panel on legislative change and visiting many of the first nations communities in the Northwest Territories. I saw many of the same deficits for children being played out there.

Those solutions should not be confined to a borderline of a territory. Those communities have been asking for the same types of opportunities to safely raise their kids as everyone else. I would encourage the territories and the federal government to ensure that the needs of those children and families are provided for.

Of course, you have the regional chief right here who can give you more specifics on what those answers have been. They have been proposed to the government for many years.

[Michael McLeod, Liberal, Northwest Territories, NT]

That's exactly what I wanted you to say.

We've heard from many witnesses on the issue of suicide. There was a lot of shock and information coming forward. We heard from Mr. Jack Hicks, who has done a lot of studies on suicide and has identified several issues that need to be tackled. We had the leader of the ITK talk about the environment in which children grow up and how it affects them later in life. In the north, we have no specialists. Doctors don't visit our communities consistently. You are lucky if you see the same doctor twice in your lifetime. Most nurses are locums, so we're probably challenged even more than southern jurisdictions.

We also have housing issues. We have issues of addiction. We need counselling, and we need jobs. All these things are issues that need to be addressed. I was really glad when you mentioned that the government, whether it's territorial, provincial, or federal, needs to learn more about our people. In our case, they need to learn more about what it's like to live in the north and the challenges we face in terms of costs and isolation.

We also heard that the corrections system is our new residential school problem. We are locking up so many people who need assistance. When I campaigned, the elders were very concerned about child apprehension.

[The Chair, Liberal, Andy Fillmore]

You have one minute, Mike.

[Michael McLeod, Liberal, Northwest Territories, NT]

Has there been any work on what it's going to cost overall to solve some of these issues?

[Dr. Cindy Blackstock]

Not as a Marshall Plan, but what we do know is what it will cost you if you don't do anything or you continue with this drop-in-the-bucket approach. The World Health Organization says that for every dollar a government spends on a child, you will save $20 U.S. down the line. Fail to spend that dollar, and you will be spending $20 down the line on corrections, mental health, and addictions programs.

It goes back to what Frederick Douglass said back in the 1800s, that if you raise a healthy child, it's cheaper than fixing a broken man. It was true then, and it's still true now.

[The Chair, Liberal, Andy Fillmore]

The next questioner is Arnold Viersen, please.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

Ms. Blackstock, I really appreciate your being here and have just a couple of things to ask.

First of all, you said, “Marshall Plan”. Could you clarify for me what that term means?

[Dr. Cindy Blackstock]

Too often the approach by Parliament in the past has been to look at issues one at a time, youth suicide, the deficits in child welfare, or maybe looking at housing or water. What we haven't done yet is look at the causal factors that tie all of these things together, which are, in my view, the inequities, the lack of recognition and support for community-based solutions, and the lack of capacity in the federal government. I think these are the types of things we need as a Marshall Plan to address all these inequalities across all areas of experience.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

You made the point that we can drill for oil offshore but we can't bring water to our first nation communities. One of the things, though, that's a complete difference is this. Drilling for oil offshore is a private enterprise deal; bringing water to first nations is entirely the federal government's responsibility.

There are other areas of life where, when it's entirely a federal government responsibility, we have complete failure as well, not only bringing water to first nations. In my own province of Alberta, we have caribou. The only two herds that have disappeared were in Jasper and Banff, which are both entirely in federal government jurisdiction.

Is there any private industry, or an alternative model, with the capability of bringing in some of these things that you have mentioned? For example, I think of one of the interesting things in Airdrie, Alberta. They have a significant hail issue. You might think there's nothing we can do about hail; however, the insurance industry, a private enterprise, seeds the clouds to make the hail smaller. I had no idea they did that. There may be a private recipe for success in some of these instances. Has that been on your radar at all?

[Dr. Cindy Blackstock]

Member, you raise an important point.

I used to work off reserve in one of the richest municipalities in Canada, West Vancouver in the British Properties, doing child protection. Never once was I asked to refer those people, as rich as they were, to seek private subsidies for their delivery of child welfare.

There are some services in this country that we have declared as being a public good. First nations should not be required to get private subsidies for services that are a public good for everybody else. That, in itself, would be discriminatory, and I'm sure not something you would support.

The other piece that's important to look at is that the Royal Commission on Aboriginal Peoples is reaching its 20th anniversary this year. It was the beginnings of that Marshall Plan we talked about. Its recommendations have never been implemented, including its call for support for first nations so that we can walk away from the Indian Act. We'd have sustainable economic, social, and spiritual infrastructure. I commend that report to you, because I feel that a lot of those same recommendations are available today. Had they been implemented, we might not be having this conversation today.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

For sure.

When it comes to education, in the province of Alberta, for example, we had one of the best education systems in the world. That was because we had a vast array of different types of education.

Clearly, what we are doing right now is not working. Asking the federal government to spend more money on all of these things is the easiest answer, but it hasn't worked in the past, and I'm not sure if spending more and more money is going to be the solution into the future.

[Dr. Cindy Blackstock]

Member, with all due respect, there's never been a time when first nations children have received an equitable education similar to what other Canadians have received. That's never been tried. I'd like to see it.

We know from the work of the Martin aboriginal educational initiative, which brought two schools up to par with equitable funding, that those kids went from very low rates of literacy to exceeding the rates of literacy for non-aboriginal kids within just a few years, so I think there are demonstrated projects that show this would work.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

For sure.

Where does the funding for the First Nations Child and Family Caring Society come from?

[Dr. Cindy Blackstock]

It's a good question because within 30 days of filing this case, the previous government cut all of our funding. We receive no government funding. It's funded completely by private donors.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

That's all for my questioning.

[The Chair, Liberal, Andy Fillmore]

I'm afraid we're out of time. We'll have to conclude this testimony.

I want to thank you very much, Ms. Blackstock and Mr. Erasmus, for joining us today. Your testimony will be most useful as we continue to deliberate on the supplementary estimates.

Thank you so much for your time.

We'll suspend for about two minutes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Andy Fillmore]

I'm going to invite committee members and those in the room to turn their minds from the supplementary estimates to the different but not unrelated issue of suicide among indigenous peoples and communities.

We're very happy today to welcome Isadore Day, the Ontario regional chief of AFN, to deliver testimony.

I think by now, regional chief, you know about the cards. The floor is yours.