Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on May 13th, 2020

[Christopher Sheppard-Buote]

I think there's a huge.... We talk about our network a lot. However, in my opening statement, I talked about the sheer number of physical urban indigenous buildings and spaces across this country. Canada has a built-in network of agencies and infrastructure that it could use as economic stimulus. If there were a national urban indigenous infrastructure fund that wasn't just $5 million this year, $8 million next year, that they looked at as part of the economic recovery but also looking to the future....

If we truly want to plan appropriately, maybe we look at how these infrastructure spaces can be properly designed, built to be—in the event that this happens again—way better designed and prepared moving forward. That doesn't just do good things for service delivery; it also does good things for having isolation spaces, gathering spaces that are safe, but also is an economic driver in over 100 ridings or communities in this country. That is an amazing opportunity for Canada to get stimulus to the ground in local economies while also looking to the future.

I think Canada needs to stop looking at friendship centres as the people who help the most vulnerable and more as a partner. That can truly shift how we look at our demographics, economies and sustainability moving forward.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Absolutely. I have an old friend I used to work with who heads up the local friendship centre. It's absolutely great for the youth, and trying to get the youth to that next step and to a great life.

I have to interrupt my question. I have a motion to table, Mr. Chair:

That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the Standing Committee on Indigenous and Northern Affairs, adopt the following motion, that, in the light of COVID-19 pandemic and how it has negatively impacted on the governance of Indigenous communities, including the postponement of elections and gathering of traditional decision making bodies, that the committee call the Wet’suwet’en elected Chiefs to provide testimony on how the COVID-19 pandemic has negatively affected their ability to enter into open and transparent negotiations regarding land rights and title with the federal government.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Are there any comments on the motion?

[Jaime Battiste, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

I'm not sure I understand it.

Marcus, you go first.

[Marcus Powlowski, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Rainy River, ON]

I didn't understand it.

You're asking to have a session to debate this issue. Is that what you're asking?

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

We're asking to have the Wet'suwet'en elected chiefs, as the motion said. I can reread the motion if you wish.

Let me just do it again. It won't take that long.

That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the Standing Committee on Indigenous and Northern Affairs, adopt the following motion, that, in the light of COVID-19 pandemic and how it has negatively impacted on the governance of Indigenous communities, including the postponement of elections and gathering of traditional decision making bodies, that the committee call the Wet’suwet’en elected Chiefs to provide testimony on how the COVID-19 pandemic has negatively affected their ability to enter into open and transparent negotiations regarding land rights and title with the federal government.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Mr. Zimmer, is this a notice of motion or is this a motion?

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

It is a notice of motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Thank you.

Mr. Battiste.

[Jaime Battiste, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Just to add to this, I appreciate the member's wanting to understand the internal ratification process of the Wet'suwet'en nation. I just don't see how this is COVID related, and I don't see how, during a discussion about off reserve with the witnesses we have available to us right now, that we'd pivot and go back to on reserve and aboriginal title lands, which they're not here to listen to. I'm wondering why.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

I'm going to interject at this point and call the motion out of order because it doesn't relate to the mandate of the committee.

It is 12:38, so that means we're going over to Ms. Zann for five minutes.

Please go ahead.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Excuse me. I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

I'm not sure it's the prerogative of the chair to decide what's relevant and not with regard to a motion. I think that's the decision of the committee. It is clearly a COVID-related issue with the motion. I'm not sure that it's at your discretion. I think it's up to the committee to decide that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

As I noted, it's not—

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

I have a point of order, Chair.

I think we've had, in meeting after meeting, ongoing discussions about this matter. I propose that since some of the Conservative members want to meddle in internal community politics, perhaps if we do put that on the table we should invite all parties involved in this discussion. I would say that it's probably not a good use of time given the nature of things we're discussing, but I think—

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Ms. Gazan, I'm going to interrupt. I'm sorry. A notice of motion is not debatable. We're moving on with the meeting at this point. We're also using up valuable time from some of our other questioners. We were going to be very nicely on time at one o'clock. Now we're a bit sidetracked, so I want to get us back on track.

Ms. Zann, you have five minutes. Please go ahead with your question.

[Lenore Zann, Liberal, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you very much.

I'd like to acknowledge that I am sitting here on the unceded land of the Mi'kmaq, very gratefully, thanks to them.

I'd like to ask a question of you, Madam Formsma, regarding friendship centres and what you are noticing with regard to violence against women and domestic violence. We are told that numbers show that statistically across the country in times like this, in this shutdown, violence and domestic violence have risen in many parts of the country, even up to 30%. It is why our government has put money into shelters and transition houses, with $207.5 million to support many organizations, $40 million to the women and gender equality centres and $26 million to women's shelters, etc.

What is this helping in your communities and in indigenous communities across the country, if anything? Are the friendship centres across the country able to access any of that funding? If so, how do you use it? If not, what do you need?

[Jocelyn Formsma]

Thank you. Maybe I could speak to what we're hearing nationally. I don't know if members from TASSC or Edith from Val-d'Or have any comments about what they're experiencing locally.

We have heard that there are increases in calls to friendship centres for support with violence in the home. What's happening because of the isolation measures is that where we put people, or where we can remove or move people, is very limited for shelters that friendship centres are running or partnering with.

Again, I'll go back to how availability doesn't always mean accessibility. Just because the funding has been available—and theoretically friendship centres should have been able to access some of that—I can't say there's been widespread access by friendship centres. A lot of the first nations funding for shelters went to on-reserve funding, very rightfully so. Also, then, the funding for women's shelters just generally went to a lot of the mainstream shelters, women's shelters within the urban spaces.

We end up in that jurisdictional gap again. If there's something available off reserve, because we're seen as indigenous non-profits, they think the federal government has given us money for something, or that it's the federal government's responsibility, and the federal government is saying that this money is available to all organizations, we should be able to access it through those means and we don't need a specific amount for urban indigenous.

Yes, we definitely have heard about the increase. The ability for friendship centres to access the funding has really been quite piecemeal across the country. Certainly, nationally we haven't been able to get anything cohesive through our office, not to say that we should, but that's been our experience.

I don't know if Edith or TASSC might have more localized experiences.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

You have one minute.

[Lenore Zann, Liberal, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Does anybody want to respond?

[Lindsay Kretschmer]

At the local level here in Toronto, we've mobilized very quickly across member agencies. In particular, Native Women's Resource Centre; Thunder Woman Healing Lodge Society; Aboriginal Legal Services, ALS; and Council Fire have worked collaboratively to try to get a crisis line together, put funding proposals in to the province and work with the city on getting accommodations.

We've been actively moving, but we do need governments to move with us at all levels because right now some of these agencies are, in fact, out-of-pocket for the expenditures of trying to put people up in a hotel to make sure that they have a safe place to land.

While we're all sorting out, as my colleague Jocelyn said, our jurisdictional issues, I think what we're finding is that the work doesn't stop, the need doesn't stop. If a woman needs to leave her home with her children, that needs to happen now, whether agencies have the money to support that or not. Those are transportation costs, food costs, laundry costs, relocation costs and accommodation costs. Then, where is the permanent housing to place them when this is over?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

We're at time there. Thank you for that.

We'll go back to the Conservative Party.

Mr. Schmale, you have five minutes, please.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you again to the witnesses.

I'll go back to National Chief Bertrand.

National Chief, this morning on the news there are many articles about your organization starting a lawsuit against the federal government. Is there anything more you'd like to say about that?

[National Chief Robert Bertrand]

The only thing that I could add is that we have tried on numerous occasions to reach out to the federal government—to CIRNAC, to ISC—to try to increase the funding because the amount that CAP has received for its constituents across Canada is a slap in the face. After hours of discussion at the board of directors level.... We hate to have done it, but in our opinion, it was the only option left to help our constituents. Yes, CAP is out there—the executive is out there—to try to help out, but never forget that we are there for our constituents. We are there for the people in P.E.I., Winnipeg, Prince Albert and Edmonton. We want to help our constituents, and we felt that this was the only way. You know when you're stuck in the corner and have no place to go? This was the only option left open to us.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON]

Maybe just to give the committee—I know that many people know these stats, so maybe anyone listening in or viewing.... Maybe you could talk about the number of people who have affiliations with your organization who you could be assisting, if given the proper resources.

[National Chief Robert Bertrand]

I just mentioned a few of them a while ago in my opening remarks. You know, in P.E.I., the organization there helps the youth with housing. In the other maritime provinces, they have commercial fishing. The organizations that we have, they have communities in each of the provinces, and they are so close to the population. These people know what is missing.

You can come up with all kinds of programs—people sitting in Ottawa in their offices—but it's these people out there who have seen the problems, who have seen the misery, who have seen what COVID-19 has done to the elders, to the youth, to the kids. These are the ones we have to be reaching out to and have the resources to help, the programs that they've deemed necessary for their area—because I am sure that what would work in Saskatchewan would not necessarily work out in Labrador—