Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Jan. 28th, 2021

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Good evening, Minister Mendicino. It's good to see you for the first time this year.

I gather that we'll have the opportunity to see each other many times, and perhaps even more often, since yesterday we passed a motion for Raïf Badawi, which I plan to keep a close eye on.

Regarding the topic at hand this evening, I'll steal your thunder since I'll be talking about the Constitution. The issue is a difference between the call to action number 94 and the wording of the bill. In the call to action, the word “Constitution” doesn't appear, whereas it appears in the bill.

I want to start by asking you who came up with the initiative to include the Constitution in the bill.

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Thank you for your question, Ms. Normandin.

I'm always happy to work with you and your caucus on the reconciliation project.

To answer your question, I can say that we started a consultation process with all national indigenous leaders and organizations.

During this process, we also received feedback on the specific language to use. We adhered to the meaning of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission's recommendations. We even took lessons on the language of the charter.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

I'll clarify my question.

Did the first nations, Inuit and Métis people specifically request that the word “Constitution” be added?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

The wording of the bill reflects all our consultations with indigenous leaders and with others who participated in the process.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

I'll repeat my question anyway. Did the government or the first nations want to include the word “Constitution”? Who made the request?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

It's the product of the process in general.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Minister Mendicino, I want to know whether you believe that it's important to reach a consensus, so that we can pass the bill as quickly as possible and send a clear message to the first nations. Would you like to see a consensus on the passage of the bill?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Yes, certainly. It's an honour for me to speak with you and with all the committee members.

I prefer an approach that involves a great deal of consultation in order to reach a consensus. We must continue this process with the leaders of indigenous communities.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

I'm a Quebecer. There isn't necessarily a consensus on the Constitution in Quebec. Moreover, no Quebec premier, whether federalist or sovereignist, has adhered to the Constitution.

The Bloc Québécois will most likely move an amendment to remove the word “Constitution”, while maintaining the recognition of indigenous rights, whether they be treaty rights or aboriginal rights.

Do you think that this approach would make it possible to unanimously pass the bill?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Ms. Normandin, I remain open to the committee's proposals. However, the wording of the bill is the product of consultations with several organizations that represent indigenous communities across Canada. I'll review the government's position after reading the committee's report.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Okay.

If the Bloc were to propose an amendment to remove the word “Constitution” but keep everything else, do you believe that this would achieve the goal of reconciliation with the first nations?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

As I just said, I remain open to the committee's proposals. The Constitution and the charter have played a very significant role. However, I know that the committee will continue to hear all the evidence on this issue.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

I have one last question for you.

Do the rights of indigenous peoples stem from the Constitution or are they inherent rights that pre-date the Constitution?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

The rights set out in the Constitution and the charter are inherent rights. The bill is based on these rights. The recognition of these rights is an important step towards reconciliation. You're correct in saying that these rights are very important.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Mr. Chair, I believe that my time is up.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Thank you very much.

Now, we have Ms. Kwan for six minutes.

Please go ahead.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Just to clarify, I will be taking the first hour, and then MP Lindsay Mathyssen will be taking the second hour.

Thank you so much, Minister, for coming to the committee.

To also acknowledge the land, I'm Zooming in from the land of the Musqueam, Squamish and Tsleil-Waututh peoples here in Vancouver.

Minister, in terms of the change in the language of the citizenship oath, could you advise whether or not either you or your officials consulted directly with the chief commissioner, Murray Sinclair, on the changed language? If so, what were his thoughts on that?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Thank you, Ms. Kwan, and thank you for your participation tonight.

I certainly had some informal discussions with Senator Sinclair in the lead-up to the tabling of this legislation, and that was part of a rather broad and expensive set of consultations with the NIOs.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Was there specific consultation with respect to the language of the oath and the changed language—what he recommended in his recommendation 94 versus what is in this bill?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

As you recall, Ms. Kwan, Senator Sinclair was the original sponsor and chair of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission's calls to action. As we know, there was an evolution between the specific wording of that original text and the text that is before you. Yes, I did have informal conversations with Senator Sinclair as part of an extensive consultation process conducted by my department.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

For clarity purposes, maybe we can have the officials from your department share with the committee specifically those comments from Senator Sinclair. I would be very interested in understanding his perspective on it. I think it would assist us in this work.

In terms of going forward, this is the third time we've been here. I really wish we could get through this and make this into law. Hopefully this will be done and will not be interrupted once again by an election that would delay and defer action in this regard.

Aside from changing the wording of the citizenship oath itself, the other component that, of course, would be essential would be the education that needs to take place. One tool would be the citizenship guide, which I have a question on for the minister. Apart from that, I actually think that ongoing education needs to take place.

Is the minister or this minister's ministry providing resources? Do you have a plan in place to ensure that educational work is being done for newcomers or, I would say, even for Canadians at large?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

I agree that education will be a vitally important companion piece to amending this oath. As you heard me testify earlier, we are working in earnest to complete consultations and to update that guide so that it better reflects indigenous traditions, histories and values. That is something we wish to see done in conjunction with the amendment of the oath of citizenship because, as I've pointed out and as I think you've reaffirmed, this will not just be an important resource for citizenship ceremonies. Hopefully, this new citizenship guide will better promote and educate all Canadians and anyone who wishes to understand the Canadian experience, and that includes, essentially, reconciliation.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Aside from the guide, are there any plans within the ministry—either your department or some other department within government—that will embark on educational work with respect to the history around indigenous people for both newcomers and Canadians?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

I've offered you my view of it from our department, but I think, without question, that my colleagues Minister Bennett and Minister Miller have continued to undertake work in better educating all Canadians with regard to reconciliation. If there are specific suggestions that you may have, Ms. Kwan, I remain open to them.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Do you have a specific budget within your ministry that's allocated for educational work, beyond the citizenship guide, to advance this particular action?