Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Feb. 4th, 2021

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Everybody has a copy of the amendment, so I don't need to read it out.

I will highlight the proposed language that's being added to the language in the bill. It basically adds “including the inherent rights and titles of and the treaties and agreements with first nations, the rights and agreements with Inuit and Métis peoples”, and then it goes on to the part about the Constitution.

This language was actually proposed by the AFN from the committee's work. Subsequent to that, I also canvassed other witnesses to see whether or not they would support this language, and those witnesses who responded indicated their support.

It is important for the citizenship oath to put emphasis here, as well as to highlight the inherent rights and titles, as indicated by the AFN.

It is important for newcomers to understand both the language in the Constitution, and what preceded the Constitution and the historical rights. That's the reason I have proposed this amendment.

I hope committee members will support it moving forward.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Mrs. McLeod, please go ahead.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

The NDP has indicated that through UNDRIP, especially legislation that directly impacts indigenous peoples, a co-development process needs to be developed and put forward. In spite of the AFN indicating some thoughts around a language change, we do have other organizations, peoples....Of course, the AFN is an advocacy group, but does not have rights in its own sense.

To move these kinds of motions at this stage of the game is actually contrary to the process that has been put in place, whereby engagement with ITK, Métis and first nations has brought us to this stage.

We would not be supporting the amendment at this time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Thank you.

Ms. Normandin.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I would like to propose a subamendment.

Shall I introduce the wording?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Yes.

Madam Clerk, a subamendment is permitted at this point, right?

[Émilie Thivierge]

Yes, Ms. Normandin, you can submit a subamendment. However, it would be good if you could forward the written version to the clerk, if you have it.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Okay.

I will dictate it. You will see that it is relatively simple. We can send you the written version.

After the words “First Nations,” I would delete “title rights and the Constitution, which recognizes and affirms,” and simply replace it with “and”.

I will read the entire subamendment to you:

I swear (or affirm) that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada, respect the inherent, Aboriginal and treaty rights of First Nations, Inuit and Métis peoples and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.

If this subamendment is adopted, I would be pleased to support my colleague Ms. Kwan's amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Mr. Anandasangaree, do you wish to speak to the subamendment?

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

I wish to speak to the actual amendment itself, but substantively it's the same issue.

We believe we have consulted extensively on Bill C-8. I appreciate Ms. Kwan bringing the original amendment forward. I do note her concerns about newcomers, especially, understanding treaty rights as already covered in the oath as presented.

Bill C-8 does represent the work of many different stakeholders who have come forward and who have given input. At this stage, we understand the intention, but we believe Ms. Kwan's amendment does not necessarily reflect the consensus that was built throughout the process of developing this legislation.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Ms. Kwan, please go ahead.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. I'm speaking to the subamendment.

I will unfortunately not be supporting the subamendment. I do think it's really important to recognize title rights. Many of the court cases that we have seen centre around the acknowledgement of title rights or lack thereof. To be honest, I also think just relying on the Constitution is deficient. If we're going to be true to the history of indigenous peoples and their rights, adopting the language as proposed by the AFN is essential. Therefore, there should be a recognition of both inherent rights and title rights.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Thanks, Ms. Kwan.

I'm going to go to the legislative clerk for a comment now.

[Émilie Thivierge]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Ms. Normandin, we just want to check something.

At the moment, Ms. Kwan's amendment has the reference number 11087213. I have the impression that your subamendment is related to the following NDP amendment. I followed what you said, and it's not consistent with the amendment that we are talking about right now. So I'm wondering if your subamendment is not related to the next amendment that Ms. Kwan might want to move if this one is defeated, or if you want to make an amendment to that amendment.

Right now, what you are reading is not consistent with Ms. Kwan's amendment that's being debated at the moment, which is the one with reference number 11087213.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

You are right, I apologize.

I could make a similar subamendment to the amendment that ends with the number 213.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Thank you. We will go back to the amendment itself.

Ms. Kwan, you've made your comments. Is there anything further before we put it to the committee?

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Yes, just to ask if we could get a recorded vote, please.

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

On a point of order, Mr. Chair, are we voting on the subamendment that's going to be presented by Ms. Normandin or are we not doing the subamendment at this point—

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

No.

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

—on this particular amendment brought forward by Ms. Kwan?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

We've agreed that the subamendment wasn't appropriate to this current amendment. We have reverted back to the amendment itself, and we've asked the clerk to do a recorded vote on NDP-1.

(Amendment negatived: nays 10; yeas 1 [See Minutes of Proceedings])

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

We move on now to the second amendment offered by Ms. Kwan.

Please go ahead.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

The second amendment is a simpler version, but again it simply acknowledges the inherent rights of first nations and title rights.

The language being added to the proposed Bill C-8 language is this. After the words “that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada, including”, I'm adding “the inherent rights of first nations, title rights”.

Then it goes on to talk about the Constitution. It simply just acknowledges the fact that they do have inherent rights and title rights.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Next I have Mr. Powlowski.

[Marcus Powlowski, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Rainy River, ON]

With respect to the NDP, I think that in the Sparrow decision, the whole kind of decision was based on the fact that they recognized inherent rights—in this case fishing—as being part of the rights that were protected under section 35, so I don't think that has to be in there.