Evidence of meeting #23 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was indigenous.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Daniel Quan-Watson  Deputy Minister, Department of Crown-Indigenous Relations and Northern Affairs

Marc Miller Liberal Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC

It's important for everyone to realize, to the extent it hasn't been clear up to now, that the Government of Canada doesn't lift the long-term water advisories. The communities do. There are a number of communities that have been in long-term water advisories, like Neskantaga, that everyone saw—

8:10 p.m.

Conservative

Arnold Viersen Conservative Peace River—Westlock, AB

Is the ministry pressuring these communities to lift their water advisories?

Marc Miller Liberal Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC

We always work in partnership to ensure that the water is safe, first and foremost, and then the community takes the decision to lift the long-term water advisories. It's not the position of the Government of Canada to pressure a community to lift their long-term water advisory. Neskantaga has been under a long-term water advisory for a quarter of a century. They may have had good water that has tested clean for three months, but there's a confidence level that still needs to be achieved and we're not there yet.

The Chair Liberal Bob Bratina

Thanks very much.

We go now to Mr. Battiste.

Jaime, you have five minutes.

Jaime Battiste Liberal Sydney—Victoria, NS

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for your comments.

Last week was a good week for the Mi'kmaq community of Eskasoni. For four days elders, knowledge holders and language speakers were prioritized and received vaccines. As I think of the anxieties and fears of so many people in my community that were expressed to me just one year ago today, and then I am able to say that we've been able to save those language speakers, those knowledge holders and our elders in our community and to have the vaccines roll out, that was a very meaningful thing for our community.

I just want to thank you, Minister, for that. I want to thank the chief and council of Eskasoni for the measures they took, as well as the health workers. So for that, wela'lin.

I want to stay on health. I know it's been a year in which we've had a lot of struggles, but one of the things that have dominated headlines is systemic racism within institutions such as health. We all remember the tragedy of Joyce Echaquan and what she had to endure. Indigenous people can be apprehensive and reluctant to seek health care due to the fear of facing discrimination. You have been outspoken and a champion for the need for change.

Can you please elaborate on the work our government is doing to tackle systemic racism in health care?

Marc Miller Liberal Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC

Thank you, MP Battiste. Your advocacy is really exemplary. I can imagine the amount of pride you must feel to see your community getting priority access. I think it says something about our country that your elders and elders in communities across Canada who are the most vulnerable are getting vaccinated before the Prime Minister or me or anyone who has the privilege to sit in cabinet. That says something about our country. People may say that's a thin veneer. I don't think it is. I think it says something about how we need to conduct ourselves going forward. It's a good lesson to us all.

We know the impact of systemic racism, particularly in institutions where people are at their most vulnerable, whether that's in the health care system or in their interactions with the police. It kills and it has killed, and it will continue to do so until we fix it.

The solutions aren't easy. They don't happen overnight. If they did, I think that would sort of diminish the scope and depth of the problem. There are things we are doing immediately in Indigenous Services Canada, such as making sure that Joyce Echaquan's community is front and centre of the continuing conversation over Joyce's principle, which achieves, broadly speaking, substantive equality between indigenous and non-indigenous peoples. It's a principle we support, but we're going to need the provinces and territories to be part of this conversation. We all know about the jurisdictional spats we've had with respect to health care, and in this case those have been on the backs of indigenous peoples.

There is work that needs to be done within my department in terms of how we transform health, how we provide more mental health supports—which is a key issue coming out of the pandemic—and how we move towards distinctions-based health legislation, which will be a difficult conversation with indigenous communities who haven't felt consulted up until now. We will have to recognize that their way of conceiving their own health needs to be respected and can't be dictated to them from Ottawa.

We recognize that a number of the elements and reports that have been published to date don't need much further examination. We need to start investing in infrastructure and supporting local infrastructure and local self-governance over health infrastructure. That is key.

You perhaps have stories in your community about how that is missing compared to the situation in a similarly situated community. That's work that the federal government can do, but as you've heard through the elements of my answer, it isn't easy. It's complex, and in the case of the legislation, it will take time, because we won't succeed if we don't engage with indigenous communities. [Technical difficulty—Editor] distinctions-based health care legislation that reflects the continuing gap and the treatment of indigenous peoples as second-class citizens by the health care system in this country, regardless of the jurisdiction.

I hope I have been able to paint a bit of a picture in the couple of minutes I had.

The Chair Liberal Bob Bratina

You took it right to time. Thank you very much, Minister.

Next we have Madam Bérubé and Ms. Blaney for two and a half minutes each.

Ms. Bérubé, the floor is yours.

Sylvie Bérubé Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I am going to go back to the issue of drinking water.

Mr. Minister, because of major salary shortfalls, it is difficult to keep water system operators in those positions, especially those in First Nations.

Is the department considering an increase in funding for the development and maintenance of water systems in order to make sure that the operators of those systems are compensated according to the standards that the sector itself has established?

Marc Miller Liberal Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC

The short answer is yes. Let me remind you that, in recent months, we announced investments in work on, and community support measures for, water infrastructure. In 2025, that investment will be four times greater than it is today; that gives you an idea of how important it is. This is a an exceptional investment that will transform the way in which we plan for the sustainability of these infrastructures.

What the Auditor General pointed out in her report was the fragility of the infrastructure. Last December, we very quickly set about correcting that situation.

Sylvie Bérubé Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Let's talk about Joyce's Principle. I would like to know what the government has done to improve the situation for those women.

Marc Miller Liberal Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC

As I said in reply to a question from Mr. Battiste, it is not an overnight solution. From the outset, we made sure that the community of Manawan was front and centre in the discussions. Sometimes, there is an annoying habit of appropriating a concept and forgetting where it came from. That is not the case here. In fact, we want to make sure that Joyce's family and the people of Manawan continue to be at the centre of the discussion. The principle is not yet completely accepted, and we must be able to call for it to be implemented in all provinces. Although it's a very simple concept, it cannot be achieved overnight.

Since that tragedy, I have been ensuring that our department is making a contribution. Specifically, we have offered the community psychological support and financial resources, as required. We have also made it possible for people in the community to go to other hospitals until the situation at the Joliette hospital is resolved.

Sylvie Bérubé Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Thank you.

The Chair Liberal Bob Bratina

Thank you, both.

Ms. Blaney, we'll conclude with your two and a half minutes.

Rachel Blaney NDP North Island—Powell River, BC

Thank you, Chair.

Minister, I also have some serious concerns around indigenous housing and the fact that we still don't have a comprehensive indigenous housing strategy for Canada. We know that the member for Nunavut did a housing tour in her riding. It was absolutely horrifying to see the reality—people living in substandard housing, mould, overcrowding—and the many, many challenges that those communities are facing. The NDP is calling for an urban, rural and northern indigenous housing strategy that is governed and led by indigenous peoples and housing providers. This is different and unique from the distinction-based indigenous housing strategy that this government likes to talk about.

How long will these communities have to wait to see housing that is actually reasonable, where we don't see the overcrowding that's across Canada, and that is really led by those communities? That includes rural and urban communities on reserve and off reserve, and of course the northern communities. How long will they have to wait?

When will there be a comprehensive strategy that starts to actually deal with this profound challenge that these communities are facing? It's absolutely horrific.

I'm wondering if you could talk about that.

Marc Miller Liberal Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC

As I mentioned in a previous response, this pandemic has taught us to look at housing through a health lens, and as Minister Bennett says, it's very hard to mend what you can't measure. Part of my mandate is to complete an infrastructure plan in partnership with Minister Hussen and Minister McKenna to get a sense of where those investments need to be. It doesn't mean that we can't act quickly through short-term housing.

You saw the billion dollars that was announced by Minister Hussen for rapid housing. That will make a difference, but it's very much a small piece of the puzzle, which is really closing that infrastructure gap by 2030. People may seem to think that's a long period of time, but in infrastructure talk, that's actually a pretty short period of time.

There are investments that need to be measured, quantified and have the finances and support of the Government of Canada to do so. This government—and it's difficult to contradict it—has made historical investments in housing, but obviously, they have not been enough and they need to continue. That gap is there. What we've seen through COVID is that it is very much a health concern that has made it such that communities are three and a half to five times more vulnerable to COVID because of, in particular, the crowded living conditions that they live in.

People might say to us that we should have known it because that is the lived reality of many of the Inuit, and I wouldn't dispute MP Qaqqaq on that point.

The Chair Liberal Bob Bratina

Minister, thank you.

Thanks to the staff and the minister for attending today.

Members of the committee, that was a very interesting and forthright set of questions. There was wonderful discussion today on our topic.

Having thanked the minister and staff, who I now dismiss, it is my duty to proceed to the vote on the supplementary estimates (C) and the main estimates, in that order.

Should the committee wish to proceed as it did previously with estimates, I will ask now if I have unanimous consent to call the votes as a group and adopt them on division.

8:25 p.m.

Conservative

Jamie Schmale Conservative Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON

On division, yes.

The Chair Liberal Bob Bratina

Thanks.

DEPARTMENT OF CROWN-INDIGENOUS RELATIONS AND NORTHERN AFFAIRS

Vote 1c—Operating expenditures..........$4,211,991

Vote 10c—Grants and contributions..........$116,662,361

(Votes 1c and 10c agreed to on division)

DEPARTMENT OF INDIGENOUS SERVICES

Vote 1c—Operating expenditures..........$76,637,529

Vote 5c—Capital expenditures..........$16,646,763

Vote 10c—Grants and contributions..........$1,471,445,078

(Votes 1c, 5c and 10c agreed to on division)

CANADIAN HIGH ARCTIC RESEARCH STATION

Vote 1c—Program expenditures..........$1

(Vote 1c agreed to on division)

Thank you very much.

Once again, we don't have to go through all of those, so having adopted the supplementary estimates (C) on division, shall I report the supplementary estimates (C) 2020-21 to the House?

Some hon. members

Agreed.

The Chair Liberal Bob Bratina

Thank you very much.

We'll move on to the main estimates.

Once again, if we can proceed as we just did, do I have unanimous consent to call the votes as a group and adopt them on division?

CANADIAN HIGH ARCTIC RESEARCH STATION

Vote 1—Program expenditures..........$29,761,017

(Vote 1 agreed to on division)

DEPARTMENT OF CROWN-INDIGENOUS RELATIONS AND NORTHERN AFFAIRS

Vote 1—Operating expenditures..........$1,634,265,848

Vote 5—Capital expenditures..........$268,287

Vote 10—Grants and contributions..........$3,032,868,793

Vote L15—Loans to Indigenous claimants..........$25,903,000

(Votes 1, 5, 10 and L15 agreed to on division)

DEPARTMENT OF INDIGENOUS SERVICES

Vote 1—Operating expenditures..........$2,095,935,733

Vote 5—Capital expenditures..........$6,115,242

Vote 10—Grants and contributions..........$11,283,347,845

(Votes 1, 5 and 10 agreed to on division)

Having adopted the main estimates 2021-22 on division, shall I report the main estimates 2021-22 to the House?

Some hon. members

Agreed.

The Chair Liberal Bob Bratina

Thank you, everyone.

We are also adjourned. We'll see you tomorrow. Thank you.