Evidence of meeting #132 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 44th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was amendment.
A video is available from Parliament.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
Okay. Thanks, Mr. Battiste.
I'm not seeing any further interventions. Let's move to a vote. I don't think we need a recorded vote here.
Shall CPC-3 carry?
(Amendment agreed to on division [See Minutes of Proceedings])
(Clause 20 as amended agreed to on division)
(On clause 21)
We're on clause 21. That brings us to NDP-40.
Liberal
Liberal
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
I call this meeting back to order.
We left off at NDP-40. I'll pass the floor back over to Ms. Idlout.
NDP
Lori Idlout NDP Nunavut, NU
Qujannamiik, Iksivautaq.
While this amendment was submitted by the B.C. Assembly of First Nations, I've noted that the CPC has an amendment similar to this, which I've agreed to follow, so I'm withdrawing this amendment in favour of a Conservative amendment that will clarify things.
Qujannamiik.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
Thank you very much, Ms. Idlout.
We will then be moving on. G-5 is the next amendment we have.
I'm going to open up the floor to Mrs. Atwin to move that one.
November 21st, 2024 / 11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Jenica Atwin Liberal Fredericton, NB
I move that Bill C-61, in clause 21, be amended by replacing line 6 on page 13 with the following:
“protection zone” for the purposes of this Act. In making such a regulation, the Minister must consider how a protection zone is to be connected to First Nation lands.
The rationale behind this is removing that word “adjacent”, which I think has caused a lot of consternation with some of our witnesses—actually, many of the witnesses.
This still ensures that a protection zone must be connected to first nation land, but ensures flexibility in how they may be defined with first nations, provinces and territories. It's additional clarity, but it also ensures flexibility.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
Thank you very much, Mrs. Atwin.
I'll open it to debate.
I see Ms. Idlout has her hand up. I'll turn the floor over to you.
NDP
Lori Idlout NDP Nunavut, NU
Thank you for clarifying that.
I am still a bit concerned that it creates limitations. I wonder if we can hear from the experts about how making this amendment follows the intent of what Jenica just mentioned.
Director General, Community Infrastructure Branch, Department of Indigenous Services
Thanks for the question.
I won't reiterate conversations we've been having at this table for a while now.
We did talk about a protection zone being laws aligned between provinces, territories and first nations, a defined space. We talked about water moving from point A to point B. We've removed the concept of adjacency, although I think there are still provisions to follow.
The “connected to” term relates to.... We've talked about watersheds and rivers that flow and move, so it brings, I would say, some permanency to the concept that waters do flow and move. First nations are sometimes impacted by those watersheds, so it's less about being directly beside it; it's more about being part of an ecosystem of water that may impact a first nation.
NDP
Lori Idlout NDP Nunavut, NU
I guess I'll ask a scenario question.
It's saying “the protection zone is to be connected to the First Nation lands”. We've heard, for example, that part of the NWT's source water is in Alberta. Because we're creating this amendment, then the first nation lands, because of that connection, would be actually able to help make sure those waters in Alberta are protected.
Is that how I understand it?
Director General, Community Infrastructure Branch, Department of Indigenous Services
I would say yes. A protection zone, again, is about aligning laws. In the case of northern Alberta and southern NWT, those waters flow across borders, so it would require alignment of laws between three parties in this case—a first nation or first nations, a province and then the Government of NWT.
Liberal
Conservative
Eric Melillo Conservative Kenora, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I appreciate the answers we've had so far and the intention of this amendment.
I do have a few questions about the wording as well. In particular, I think “the Minister must consider” is vague and not necessarily binding.
On “how a protection zone is to be connected to First Nation lands”, which you just spoke about, Mr. Barbosa, when I read this and when I hear it, it sounds to me like it is maybe inadvertently placing some conditions on what a protection zone would be in terms of being connected specifically to first nation lands or perhaps not being connected to first nation lands. The minister has to figure out how that will be connected.
It just seems to me like it is perhaps inadvertently introducing some restrictions on what the protection zone could be.
Do you have any comments on that thought?
Director General, Community Infrastructure Branch, Department of Indigenous Services
The very concept of protection zones is to bring laws together. The laws would be to protect waters, so in my mind there must be a connection to water or sources of water to protect those waters and an alignment of laws.
I'm not sure if I totally get the question, but I don't think it's limiting. I think it is talking about the definition of “law” in a space and that a first nation must be implicated in that space in order to define laws in partnership with provinces and territories. I think it strengthens the nuance of the law-making ability that a first nation would have.
Conservative
Eric Melillo Conservative Kenora, ON
In your opinion, would this wording, if it passed, clarify—or perhaps “restrict” is the word—a protection zone as being specifically connected to first nation lands?
Director General, Community Infrastructure Branch, Department of Indigenous Services
As you pointed out, it says that the minister must consider how those things apply, so, in my mind, it's clarifying the law-making ability of a first nation in partnership with the provinces and territories.