Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on June 3rd, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Is that for a specific person, Mr. Iacono?

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

I'm sorry. I was addressing the question to Mr. Lamont.

[Raymond Lamont]

Again, I'm not sure I understood the gist of the question. Can you reframe it, please?

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

With respect to emergency preparedness, which encompasses several aspects, such as emergency response plans, mutual assistance agreements, resource inventories, training, etc., what more can the federal government do in order to help the situation?

[Raymond Lamont]

That's an excellent question.

One thing that occurs to me immediately is that there is a perception in Tsay Keh that Canada and B.C. are often not coordinating very well in developing solutions that benefit indigenous communities in building capacity to respond to the challenges associated with climate change, natural disasters and other emergencies. For instance, I spoke today about the Finlay Forest Service Road. It is a vital transportation link. It has major implications for indigenous communities for safety. It has other major implications.

A challenge we face is that we need resources to carry out upgrades to the road, and the question arises of how we fund that. How do we carry out those critical and necessary repairs to ensure that we have a road that's safe and reliable and that will enable Tsay Keh and Kwadacha, the other indigenous community, to respond when emergencies arise?

I think greater coordination.... I don't know what the solution is. Is it formal agreements between Canada and B.C., in which they outline or establish terms of reference for closer collaboration between Canada and B.C. in the areas that you described? Training and building capacity—

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Thank you, Mr. Lamont.

Mrs. Gill, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I will continue the discussion I had earlier with Chief Ottawa about the community’s needs.

Chief Ottawa, as no change has happened since 2010, and communities are still not ready to face potential crises, what are your recommendations for the committee?

[Chief Paul-Émile Ottawa]

Thank you for the question, Mrs. Gill. It’s a very good question.

I often attend meetings that bring together chiefs from all regions of Canada. One topic that comes up often is this perpetual war between the provinces and the federal government over jurisdiction.

In the past, all kinds of disasters have happened in Canada. I’m thinking of my brothers in British Columbia, for example, who reported the unfortunate situations they experienced and are still experiencing months after the evacuation. It would be a matter of pooling our resources and our knowledge, our skills and our expertise. Leaders, be they federal, provincial, regional or municipal, have enough shared knowledge to put mitigation measures in place when disasters happen, no matter where they happen in the country.

Canada participates in international meetings that address the impacts of greenhouse gases and climate change. Working closely with countries in the northern hemisphere is necessary to find solutions and make changes so that communities are safer, especially those in northern regions.

We could do something interesting if we work together to put in place preventative response plans to ensure everyone’s safety.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Thank you, Mrs. Gill.

Ms. Idlout, you have two and a half minutes.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut as follows:]

ᖁᔭᓐᓇᒦ, ᐋ ᓇᐃᑦᑐᒥᒃ ᐊᐱᕆᔪᒪᔪᖓ, ᐋ ᑎᐱ ᓕᔅᑰᓐᒧᑦ, ᑖᓐᓇ ᐊᑦᓱᐊᓗᒃ ᑐᓴᕐᓂᕆᖅᑲᐅᒐᒃᑯ ᓄᓇᖃᖅᑳᖅᓯᒪᔪ-ᖁᑎᖏ ᒪᓕᒐᖏᓐᓂᒃ ᐊᑐᖃᑦᑕᕐᒪᑕ, ᑖᓐᓇ ᑎᑎᖅᑲᕐᖑᖅᑎᑦᑎᓯᒪᔪᓂᒃ ᖃᓄᐃᑦᓴᕋᔭᓐᖏᒻᒪᖔᖅ ᑲᑎᒪᔨᕋᓛᑦᑎᓐᓄᑦ ᖃᐃᑦᓯᔪᓇᕋᔭᕐᒪᖔᑦᑕ ᑖᓐᓇ ᐊᒥᓱᓄᑦ ᒪᓕᑦᑕᐅᔪᒥᓇᕋᓗᐊᕐᒪᑦ ᖃᐅᔨᒪᔪᐃᓐᓇᐅᖂᕋᓗᐊᕋᑦᑕ ᑕᒪᑦᑕᑦᓯᐊᖅ ᓄᓇᖃᖅᑳᖅᓯᒪᔪᐃᑦ ᐊᓪᓚᖓᔪᑦ ᐃᓄᐃᑦ ᒪᓕᒐᖃᕋᓗᐊᕋᑦᑕ ᑭᓯᐊᓂ ᐊᔪᕐᓇᖅᑐᒃᑰᖃᑦᑕᕋᑦᑕ ᒪᓕᒐᖅᐳᑦ ᐃᓕᑕᕆᔭᐅᓕᖅᑎᓐᓇᓱᒃᓱᑎᒍᑦ ᐋ ᑖᓐᓇ ᖃᓄᐃᑦᓴᕋᔭᓐᖏᓚᑏᑦ ᐋ ᑎᑎᖅᑲᓐᖑᖅᑎᑦᑎᓯᒪᔪᒥᒃ ᖃᓄᖅ ᐊᑐᓕᖅᑎᑕᐅᒐᔭᓚᐅᖅᓯᒪᒻᒪᖔᑦᑕ.

[Inuktitut text interpreted as follows:]

Thank you. I have a short question for Debbie Lipscombe.

I enjoyed what you said about traditional law and how you apply traditional law in your everyday lives. Can you share documentation on what your traditional law is with the committee members?

I think many people could benefit a lot from the traditional law. That goes for Métis, Inuit and first nations. We all have our traditional laws, but we all run into the problem of people not recognizing our traditional laws. I think any documentation you have would be very useful in studying traditional law.

Thank you.

[English]

[Debbie Lipscombe]

Meegwetch. I would be willing to share some of the information with respect to our traditional laws.

Some of the work that's gone on in our territories is that we've been able to develop tool kits, which help explain our laws to the leadership and especially to up-and-coming youth, and how the laws connect. We've also been doing some work with our municipalities to explain our laws, because our 55,000 square miles in Treaty No. 3 encompass a number of urban areas, such as Kenora, Dryden, Sioux Lookout and Red Lake. It's important they understand our laws and how our laws can be harmonized so we can work and occupy a shared space.

Meegwetch.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut as follows:]

ᖁᔭᓐᓇᒦᒃ, ᓇᐃᑦᑐᒥᑦᑕᐅᖅ ᐋ ᓰᑉ ᐋᕐᓄᓪᑦ ᓚᐳᕉᓪᒧᑦ ᐊᐱᕆᔪᒪᕗᖓ ᐋ ᐊᐃᑦᑖᖑᒐᓗᐊᕐᒪᑦ ᑐᓴᖅᓱᓂ ᐋ 200ᓂᒃ ᐅᓪᓗᕐᓂ ᐅᖓᑖᒍᑦ ᑕᐃᑲᓂ ᐋ ᑐᐊᕕᕐᓇᖅᑐᒃᑯᕕᒻᒦᑎᑕᐅᓯᒪᓕᕋᑦᓯ ᖃᓄᕐᓕ ᑐᑦᓯᕋᕋᔭᖅᐱᑦ ᑖᒃᑯᐊ ᐋ ᑕᐃᑲᓃᑦ-ᑐᓐᓂᒃ ᓄᓇᒋᔭᑦᓯᓐᓄᑦ ᐅᑎᕆᐊᖃᕐᓂᕈᑦᓯ ᖃᓄᖅ ᑐᑦᓯᕋᕋᔭᖅᐱᑦ ᐅᑎᖅᓵᓕᕐᔫᒥᔪᒪᓂᕐᒧᑦ ᓄᓇᒋᔭᑦᓯᓐᓄᑦ.

[Inuktitut text interpreted as follows:]

Thank you.

I have another question for Chief Arnold Lampreau.

I am sorry to hear that you had emergency measures in place for over 200 days. In the near future, when you have to return to your community, how do you plan to go back there? Will it be as planned, or earlier?

[English]

[Chief Arnold Lampreau]

I'm sorry. I didn't understand that. I don't have an interpreter.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

Okay. I'm devastated to hear that you personally have been in evacuation for over 200 days.

I wondered if you had any ideas or needs. Could you share them with us through our standing committee, so that we can find out how we can pressure the federal government to get your needs met so that you can return to your home?

[Chief Arnold Lampreau]

As we speak, I'm getting some Facebook images from back home, because I'm in Vancouver at a meeting for the UBCIC conference. I'm getting pictures of the water rising again in the Nicola, where it never used to go. I might just have to take off here pretty quickly and find out what's going on back home.

A few of our reserve bands within the Scw'exmx nation have been actually having the same problems and challenges that we face here in the Nicola. They're actually postage stamp sizes of reserve lands. They're basically on the sides of hills, with not much land on the river bottoms. Right now when the river rises, because of the devastation that's happened, the gravel has risen and so has the river, so the chance of it washing away more houses is higher.

We're looking at trying to get safer land and some more housing. Some of our housing dates back to the fifties. When we brought our people back in February, some of them were unsure. They were actually scared to go back home.

One thing we did was do all the housing inspections to ensure that those houses were safe to go back to. We checked for mould, electrical, water and replaced some of the appliances. Some of these things were challenging because of COVID. Trying to get a lot of the appliances in right away was just a nightmare. Then, of course, communications were down, the Internet was down, so there was fear over telephones for emergencies. The flood was on for my cellphone and my office. My poor staff were just overwhelmed because of the fear of somebody getting hurt or having a heart attack or accident.

All of these challenges just reared their ugly faces. How do you deal with that?

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Thank you, Chief.

For the benefit of everyone, we're going to complete this second round. There are five more minutes for the Conservatives and five minutes for the Liberals, and then we'll have to end the panel.

I honestly don't know who will speak at this point, but whoever is going to speak for the Conservatives, you have five minutes.

[Gary Vidal, Conservative, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

I think it's Mr. Shields.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Go ahead, Mr. Shields.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I think it's come up in a number of conversations we've had in previous committees. I would like to thank the witnesses for again bringing up the issue of capacity.

I'd like to start with Chief Lamont in the sense of the federal government working with indigenous people on the capacity that leads to economic development and then the coordination of safety. I think you've talked about it a couple of times.

Could you just comment, in the sense of the future, on what changes you believe need to be made for the capacity changing from the hands of the federal government to the nations?

[Raymond Lamont]

Tsay Keh has always maintained that we don't expect and we don't want the government to solve Tsay Keh's problems. Tsay Keh wants to have the ability to solve its own problems. In order to achieve that, Tsay Keh must build capacity and human resources. It requires capital and funding to build the capability to respond to emergencies and to make its own decisions in its own interest.

What we see is that, for many of the projects that Tsay Keh is developing, economic development projects.... For instance, we have negotiated an agreement to participate in a high-performance computing facility in the town of Mackenzie. We are collaborating on a project to build a biofuel plant that will produce clean diesel. All of these projects have major implications for Tsay Keh and Tsay Keh Dene capacity.

These projects have the potential to produce own-source revenue that Tsay Keh could use and allocate as it sees fit to address some of the challenges and the problems that we've identified. For example, there's the biomass project I spoke about today. That project has the potential to be transformative. It will create jobs. It will significantly address the issue of food security. If we had the money to build it on our own, we would. The reality is that we don't. Funding to build that project is critical.

If a first nation is empowered to solve its own problems and it is has own-source revenue on which it can draw, it has the ability to make its own decisions to solve its problems. I believe that community will be more resilient and better able to respond to problems. It will have the ability to mitigate the risks.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you.

Chief Ottawa, in response to the same question, when you're talking about safety and capacity, from your viewpoint in the province of Quebec, would you respond in a similar way, to the sense of capacity? Do you believe that you might have to deal with the safety issues you've identified?

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Chief Ottawa, did you hear the interpretation?

[Chief Paul-Émile Ottawa]

I know that the question was for me, but the sound kept fading and I only heard half of the question.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Let's try that again.

Go ahead, Mr. Shields. Perhaps you could repeat your question.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

We're talking about capacity, and you have identified safety issues, whether they're to do with roads, fire or isolation. Do you believe that in a different relationship with the federal government, you could deal with the issues that you've identified, because you would have the capacity developed in a different way?