Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on May 29th, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

I said I would give you the additional 40 seconds, which I did.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Did you? Did you give me 40 seconds, or did you give him 40 seconds to not answer a question?

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

That's not what I said. I said I would give you an additional 40 seconds after my clock was—

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

I'd like to request a review of what we talked about. I'd like to revisit this, because it's simply not the impression that was left.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

That's fair enough. In the meantime, we'll move on to Mr. McLeod for six minutes.

[Michael McLeod, Liberal, Northwest Territories, NT]

Thank you, Madam Chair. I want 40 seconds extra, too.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[Michael McLeod, Liberal, Northwest Territories, NT]

Thank you again to the ministers for joining us, and thank you to their teams.

My first question is going to be for Minister Miller. It's probably not going to come as a surprise.

The Northwest Territories has 15 tables where discussions are being conducted on negotiations. Some of them are going very well, and some of them are still struggling.

For sure, we're still feeling the effects from the Conservative government's decision in 2014 to make cuts in the budget for band councils, tribal councils and the negotiating processes. It's something we're still struggling with in the communities.

I think I've raised many times with you, Minister Miller, that we need a better investment in the process, the whole self-government and land claims process. We also need new policies.

I'm very encouraged to see that your department has increased its investment in negotiations and in the implementation of land claims and self-government agreements and treaties by nearly half a billion dollars year over year.

I want to ask you to explain how this increase in funds will support addressing the priorities of the communities, especially those in the north.

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

Thank you.

This is the first time I've heard Minister Vandal being accused of talking too much. He's a man of few choice, pointed words, so that's a first.

To answer your point, you're absolutely right. The mains reflect increased transfers to modern treaty holders, a good number of which are situated in the Northwest Territories, as well as the second component of your question, which is increased support for the negotiation process. That means just sitting at the negotiation table and hammering out what could be some groundbreaking, historic settlements with communities in the Northwest Territories.

I think we're a whole heck of a lot closer than we were this time last year, and, indeed, there are a number of communities that are happy with the agreement being put in front of them and will take that next step of talking to their community members.

When we talk about modern treaties, we talk about how we reflect our relationship as a government with indigenous communities that have section 35 rights. That presumes a relationship of equals, so we are making sure those tables are properly funded. Making sure those communities have the ability to deal on a nation-to-nation, equal-to-equal basis is critical.

What we see in the estimates are two things. One, as I said earlier, is increased funds for making sure we are doing as we should, which is sitting at the table and negotiating some very difficult points. I can't guarantee all of them get solved.

Also, increasing the transfer payments, for lack of a better word, in the modern treaty relationship means that this is not enveloped programming that people have to apply for, but really grant-type format funding that goes to infrastructure and housing and is game-changing for the communities. A lot of what you're seeing year over year is that increased investment into those relationships, a good number of them being in the Northwest Territories.

[Michael McLeod, Liberal, Northwest Territories, NT]

Thank you for that response.

I'm also very pleased to see that Northern Affairs is increasing its support related to contaminated sites and abandoned mine reclamation by almost $150 million year over year. The Northwest Territories has many of these projects, and Minister Dan Vandal is quite familiar with the Giant Mine, the Silver Bear Mines and the Canol Trail.

Can you explain how these funds will help the government work with indigenous partners to clean up these sites, while supporting local decision-making and economic participation?

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Actually, I had the opportunity to visit Giant Mine last July, when I was up on my northern tour. I went to Inuvik for nutrition north and visited the people of Giant Mine. I can tell you that this is part of our government's commitment to clean up and to remediate the top eight mines in all three territories. We're doing so with the perspective that those who have suffered throughout the years—the local communities, the first nations and other indigenous nations—should benefit now from the cleanup and the remediation.

As of May 2022, 51%—or approximately $315 million in contracts—has been awarded to indigenous contractors for Giant Mine alone.

As well, thanks to your leadership, MP McLeod, in August 2021, the Government of Canada and the Yellowknives Dene First Nation signed a co-developed community benefits agreement to make sure that the Yellowknives Dene will benefit from the remediation.

That's a principle we are going to operate on in all of the major mine cleanups in the north in the years that come.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

Thank you, Mr. McLeod.

Go ahead, Mrs. Gill. You have six minutes.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd like to thank the ministers, Mr. Vandal and Mr. Miller, for meeting with the committee today. This gives us an opportunity to follow up on discussions we began earlier in the year.

Mr. Vandal, I'd like to talk about the nutrition north Canada program, which we've discussed before. As you mentioned, through the budget, the government is investing in the program once again. The needs of the various communities are tremendous.

You said that your department wasn't the only one responsible, that other departments play a role in fulfilling this responsibility of the government's. I'd like an update on that. If I'm not mistaken, the government is investing $180 million in the nutrition north Canada program.

What work is being done in other departments? Do you always work together as a team? I know you asked about a round table or working group, since a number of departments are involved. What exactly is your role in delivering that $180‑million investment? How do the other departments help you to ensure food sovereignty or make it less expensive for northern populations to put food on the table?

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Thank you for that excellent question.

In the past few years, we have worked closely with Marie-Claude Bibeau, the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food, on food programs. We've also worked with Fisheries and Oceans Canada to deliver surplus fish at a time when Canadians were struggling.

I can't speak to what those two departments are doing in detail, but I know that, back in July, we announced $163 million for nutrition north Canada in Inuvik, in the Northwest Territories. That funding will support communities, not only through the harvesters support grant and the community food programs fund, but also through community food programs developed with indigenous partners.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

I gather that there aren't really any new developments. Correct me if I'm wrong, but those are ad hoc programs. There isn't an actual round table ensuring that all the measures are coordinated under a long-term vision.

You talked about significant investments in certain communities, but they aren't necessarily broken down here. Would you say those government investments are equitable across the board? I'll take it a step further. Are they equitable in relation to the communities? Obviously, as a member, I represent some of those communities, but I speak with other community members as well. The nutrition north Canada program still has dire problems. It doesn't even cover some communities, even though they meet all the requirements needed to be eligible because of their remote location.

First, do you think it's equitable? Second, do you think the programming needs to be expanded or reviewed at some point? Even though investments are being made, people in northern communities are still suffering because they don't have access to affordable good-quality food.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

That's a very important question.

A major requirement in order to be eligible for nutrition north Canada is that the community has to be isolated, in other words, without road access for much of the year. I'm not sure how the program is administered. The needs in northern communities are no doubt significant. Many communities are isolated, so that's why we try to find more resources in conjunction with our community and indigenous partners. We are trying to find innovative and creative ways to deliver the program.

I'm going to ask Paula Isaak to say more about how the nutrition north Canada program is administered.

[Paula Isaak, Associate Deputy Minister, Department of Crown-Indigenous Relations and Northern Affairs]

Thank you, Minister.

As you just pointed out, to be eligible for the program, communities have to be isolated. We do review the list of isolated communities from time to time, and since 2011, the number of eligible communities has increased to 122. If we receive an application from a committee, we can check whether it should receive nutrition north Canada subsidies. The program is subject to ongoing review.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

Yes, but—

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

Your time is up, Mrs. Gill.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

We go now to Madam Idlout for six minutes. I just want to make sure everyone is on the proper interpretation channel.

Thank you.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut, interpreted as follows:]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I will be asking questions similar to Mr. Zimmer's. I am concerned [Technical difficulty—Editor]

[English]

I will be asking my questions in English.

First of all, to Minister Vandal, could you please provide us data about the comparison in funds in the nutrition north program, and how much you're giving to for-profit corporations compared to the harvesters support grant?

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

I'm going to turn to the public service to provide the data, but I know the harvesters support program has been very successful. It was co-developed with indigenous—

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

I'm asking for a comparison, please.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Paula, could you provide that?