Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Dec. 13th, 2023

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

It's the amendment itself.

[Julia Redmond]

Okay.

It's setting out the same process that this committee considered in a previous amendment. As opposed to being for the treaties, it's for the supplementary self-government agreements. It's the same process that was set out before. The impact is that the previously contemplated process of these coming into force by order in council would require that they be tabled in Parliament before that order comes into force.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

That's right.

What would happen if a copy of the agreement in any of the first 10 days doesn't happen?

I guess I'm just asking what the implications are of this amendment. If it's past 10 days, what will the actions have to be?

I'm asking for more details. You'll have to forgive me if I don't remember what the previous similar amendments were. We've been in this for a while. I need better descriptions than what you're saying to me.

[Julia Redmond]

I'm saying here that this sets out a requirement for tabling in Parliament. That requirement is so that the order can come into force. If that requirement isn't met, that could mean that the order in council, which in this case would give force and effect to a supplementary self-government agreement, may not be able to come into force. It could be as simple as a new tabling or a new order. There would be procedural ways to resolve not meeting that requirement. However, that requirement would need to be met at some stage for that relevant order to come into force. That's what this is saying.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

Mr. Schmale, you're next on my list.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON]

Chair, I had the same question that Ms. Idlout did. I forgot to ask the officials, and she did.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

Okay.

I have nobody else on my speaking list. We're going to call the question on CPC-4.

Shall CPC-4 carry?

(Amendment agreed to: yeas 11; nays 0 [See Minutes of Proceedings])

(On clause 11)

We'll now move to clause 11.

Mr. Schmale, this is your amendment. Would you like to move CPC-5?

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON]

I would, and thank you, Chair.

This is from the testimony I think we've heard from both Métis and first nations leaders who came to the committee to testify. This added a bit more clarity to the piece of legislation, especially around the treaty process.

I do agree with what Mr. Battiste said—I can't remember how many meetings ago—which was that indigenous peoples will find their own path and work towards a treaty. I think that is fantastic.

This just gives a little oversight at the end rather than an order in council, which can be done by cabinet regardless of which government is in power. I think it is essential, especially in our parliamentary democracy, to have that parliamentary oversight and to ensure that parliamentarians of all parties have the ability to look this over.

This amendment gives the 30-day period when parliamentarians will be able to look at this legislation to potentially scrutinize it or even broadly support it. It's that extra oversight that I think, in our parliamentary democracy, needs to be there. That's why I move this motion, in accordance with the testimony we heard from leaders from across the country.

Just quickly to the officials at the table, is that all good?

[Michael Schintz]

I think it's an effective way to accomplish the objectives that I understand the committee is trying to accomplish.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

I don't have any other speakers for CPC-5, so we're ready to call the question on CPC-5.

(Amendment agreed to: yeas 11; nays 0 [See Minutes of Proceedings])

(Clause 11 as amended agreed to: yeas 11; nays 0 [See Minutes of Proceedings])

Thank you.

Colleagues, for clauses 12 through 19, we have no amendments.

Are there any clauses that anyone would like to speak to regarding clauses 12 to 19, or would we have unanimous consent to group them together for one vote?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

No.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

(On clause 12)

Go ahead, Ms. Idlout.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

I feel that I am the wrong person to ask this, but can we just ask the lawyers to explain the impact of each of these clauses to us, just so that we're sure what we're going to be agreeing to? I don't want to ask them if—

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

Could we have our officials speak to clause 12?

[Julia Redmond]

Clause 12 gives legal force, in effect, to supplementary self-government agreements. It is as simple as it sounds. It corresponds to a previous clause in the bill, which deals with giving legal force and effect to treaties.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

I don't know if they want to go clause by clause to do this.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

It's probably easiest if we just do an explanation for a clause, and then vote, and then go to the next one for an explanation and vote.

I have no one to speak further on clause 12, so I'll call the question on clause 12.

(Clause 12 agreed to: yeas 11; nays 0)

(On clause 13)

We'll turn first to the officials, if they'd like to offer an explanation on clause 13.

[Michael Schintz]

Clause 13 is with respect to the tax treatment of the Métis governments.

It specifies that there will be a tax treatment that's negotiated with each of the Métis governments. Those negotiations are led by Finance Canada. They have to do with the tax exemptions of a government and giving these Métis governments the same exemptions that are available to other governments in Canada under general tax laws.

It's specifically to do with the income tax treatment of the Métis governments and any of their subsidiaries under the Income Tax Act. It has to do with a refund on GST paid by the Métis governments in respect of goods and services acquired for the purposes of carrying out governmental responsibilities. It's a limited area of tax treatment.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

Is there any further discussion?

Go ahead, Mr. Viersen.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

I guess I get that. It's just that clause 13 doesn't say anything about the GST or the excise tax. Is there a separate agreement that this references?

[Michael Schintz]

This is a side agreement to the treaty.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

Does it already exist?

[Michael Schintz]

It does not yet exist. It will be negotiated with Finance Canada as the treaties are negotiated.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

You're expecting a GST exemption. I don't read a GST exemption in this.