Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Feb. 24th, 2026

[Chief Pauline Frost]

Thank you.

Yes, I'd love to respond.

I would like to highlight that UNDRIP sets a minimum standard that Canada should meet for indigenous rights. However, modern treaties are protected under section 35 of the Constitution from 1982. As such, and unlike UNDRIP, modern treaties have the force and effect of law in Canada. The role of the modern treaty commission would be to ensure legal obligations contained in modern treaties are fully and effectively implemented in a timely manner and with the spirit and intent in which the parties entered into them.

As President Clayton advised, it's the floor, not the ceiling. Modern treaties give us certainty, and that's what we look for.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Côte-Nord—Kawawachikamach—Nitassinan, QC]

To conclude, I don't think my question was understood either, but, okay, I'll report what happened. Actually, I just wanted to…. I guess I was trying to say that it fits into…. I wanted to say that, for first nations, having an independent commissioner who will oversee the implementation of treaties is a good thing.

That will be all, Mr. Chair. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Sheehan]

Thank you very much.

MP Schmale, go ahead for five minutes.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes, ON]

Thank you very much to the witnesses. It's good to see everyone again.

As we spoke about before in person, the concern we have with this piece of legislation is the consequences piece. We agree that governments of all stripes, over hundreds of years, have failed to live up to the word of treaties, whether historic, modern or otherwise. We agree that there needs to be fundamental change within government departments. We agree that an extra oversight body adds some additional, well, oversight.

At the same time, we talk about officers of Parliament. The Auditor General is one. I can't tell you how many reports we've had that outline the many issues with the government and indigenous peoples. I can't tell you how many studies we've had in this committee in my time. I've been on this committee for six or seven years now. We've done multiple studies on indigenous policing. We've done multiple studies on food prices in the north and how they're out of control. We've done multiple studies on housing on reserve. We get reports back showing that, yes, funding has increased, but the improvements made do not match up.

We have all this information in front of us and nothing seems to change. There seem to be no consequences. Now we're creating a new officer of Parliament who is going to come up with a new report, and there are many things to criticize. Absolutely.

Where is the enforcement piece? That's our concern. Will there be any changes? We want to see the government live up to the word of its treaties. Will we get there with this?

That's for Chief Sunshine, Chief Clayton or their legal friend.

[Jaime Battiste, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso—Antigonish, NS]

You just depressed all of us with that. We're going nowhere. We have nothing.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Sheehan]

Go ahead, Chief Sunshine.

[Chief Sheldon Sunshine]

Thank you.

That would be best answered by the modern treaty folks, since this is a commissioner for them.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes, ON]

Eva is ready to go. It looked like she was taking notes.

[Eva Clayton]

Thank you for the question, MP Schmale.

I want to highlight what you talked about—the multiple studies.

This isn't about studies; it's about accountability. It's about holding all of us accountable to the agreements we made. It has nothing to do with studies and everything to do with the implementation of the provisions of the treaties.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes, ON]

If I could quickly point this out, my linking to the studies was about the fact that more information continues to be put on the table and nothing seems to change. Whether it's in studies or reports, there's a ton of information. That's what I was trying to get to.

[Eva Clayton]

Thank you for the clarification. Still, it's all about accountability.

I will do one piece, and then I'll turn it over to my colleague in terms of enforcement.

The Auditor General has a specific mandate regarding the Government of Canada. There's no specific mandate for the Auditor General regarding modern treaties. I think that will be my answer to your question.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes, ON]

Okay.

I have a follow-up to that one.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Sheehan]

Go ahead, Ms. Paulin.

[Brianne Paulin]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

We need to go back to the purpose of the commission itself. It is to provide oversight and credible, independent information to Parliament. The enforcement blurs that line. If an agent is now responsible for enforcing their own recommendations, it blurs the independence of that agent. Ultimately, it's up to Parliament to make sure those recommendations are implemented.

What is interesting about this commissioner is that, on the other side, you have the modern treaty groups, which will be reviewing every report that comes out and can even ask the commissioner to undertake investigations. Those investigations will come directly to Parliament and this committee, so the committee will be able to review them and ensure that recommendations are implemented.

I'm speaking for President Clayton, and I hope I don't get kicked under the table. The modern treaties.... Of course, we'll be taking those reports and implementing them as well, because that's the point of the commission. It's independent from both Parliament and modern treaties. We'll be implementing the recommendations.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Sheehan]

Thank you. That's all the time we have.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes, ON]

I don't think your glasses are working, Chair. There's an extra couple of minutes. I'm just going to....

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Sheehan]

No, that's the time we had.

You can follow up on anything in writing as well, if you want.

Next, we have Philip for five minutes

[Philip Earle, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

Thank you.

If I have the will of the committee, I'm going to convey some of my time to Lori, the representative from the NDP.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Sheehan]

Is it the will of the committee? I have a thumbs-up. We're okay over there.

[Philip Earle, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

Thank you.

My question is going to be directed to President Clayton. It was nice to chat with you before the committee.

To all the witnesses, thank you for being here today.

I heard you, in your earlier testimony, talk about how important Bill C-10 is and that you support it. I'm a bit preoccupied with the consultations that were done between the government and the modern treaty holders.

Can you tell the committee about your journey in this regard, your own experience as it relates to the consultation and why it's so important to implement Bill C-10 now?

[Eva Clayton]

It's so very important for Bill C-10 to go through, simply because we've been living....

I set out the example that under the Nisg̱a’a treaty, there have been no consultations from Canada and the various departments when it comes to speaking with other indigenous groups. I want to give one key example. In the negotiation of the new treaties, Canada, without consulting with the Nisg̱a’a, added a piece of our territory to be negotiated, and that's just not right. I think that's important when we look at how those consultations will work, and the commissioner will come up with a consultation policy when it comes to that.

The other area is mining. There is a piece on mining, whether it's in B.C. or Canada, so mining and exploration companies have to consult all indigenous groups within the nation. There's no consideration of the treaty-protected lands when they issue those consultations. That happens as well.

That's it in a nutshell.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Sheehan]

Thank you.

Lori, you have two minutes and 25 seconds.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

Qujannamiik. Thank you.

Thank you so much to the witnesses.

Just to create clarity on this important study, which the NDP supports, I think what we need to understand is the difference between policies and what governments study as policies, and what indigenous peoples and the modern treaties are talking about, which are rights. I think that's where the differences are.

I wonder if you agree with me that Bill C-10 is about making sure that rights are being upheld through the commissioner's role. Are there other bodies that help to make sure that rights are being upheld through non-partisan ways or in an independent way? Can you share your responses to that?

[Eva Clayton]

Thank you for the question, Lori.

Yes, it's so very important for the rights of the treaty to be respected. Those rights were negotiated in each of the agreements that modern treaties hold, and they have to be upheld. The commissioner will assist the modern treaties in doing that.